4 ms·

How many New Yorkers have you talked to? Not everyone is happy paying several times the rent of their neighbors, just because they were there first. We're als

How many New Yorkers have you talked to? Not everyone is happy paying several times the rent of their neighbors, just because they were there first. We're also not really happy that a lot of the housing is slum-quality, since landlords generally want their tenants to move out and the law obliges them to make sure the guy paying $3000 and the guy paying $500 are equally miserable.

busterarm 11y ago
I'm a rent-controlled tenant in a beautiful apartment building on West 55th Street. My rent is low, but not obscenely so. I lived here through the hard times when the neighborhood was shitty and filled with derelicts, winos and prostitutes. We all kept the building clean and nice. We lived in the building when _nobody wanted to live here_. We chased out the crooks who used to try to mug people in our elevator and kick open doors. The landlord made improvements to the building because the way the rent control law is designed, _they have to_ to get rent increases. And we're still here and a great tenant and great neighbors. Oh and of course the landlord has been trying all sorts of illegal means to get us (and the single-digit handful of other controlled tenants, 100+ unit building) out - and regularly gets verbally slapped around by a judge in housing court. It's a good thing we held on to hold on to _all of our records related to being in this apartment all the way back to 1970_...because we had to.
- cynicalkane 11y ago
  Congratulations, you got yours. Bragging about how nice your life personally is does not constitute good economics. In terms of anecdata, however, New York is famous for its shitty apartments and byzantine lending process. I don't recall ever being shown good, affordable apartment in the area where I live--and I have a good job. Bug infestations, code violations, warped walls and floors, heating systems a century old, wasteful lack of insulation running up the A/C bill and wasting energy--all these are the norm in a part of America many times more expensive than usual. If you have an everyday middle class job there's not a chance you will be able to enjoy a good apartment near the city. But I'm glad you're happy. You obviously deserve being rewarded for randomly renting the right apartment at the right time at no economic risk to yourself. It's only fitting that you use your lucky position as an excuse to exclude others as much as you can.
  - busterarm 11y ago
    Yes, the <1.8% of us with _actually low_ rents (most stabilized apartments aren't nearly that low) are the reason you can't get an affordable apartment. Keep dreaming. Also, it's not just a matter of "I got mine." Living where I am afforded me class mobility that I likely would not have had in my life otherwise. I've been _dirt poor_ for most of my life, even in this apartment. What is your alternative to that? Why are you so focussed on what other people have?
    - dang 11y ago
      Both of you are breaking the HN guidelines by being personally abrasive. Please comment civilly and substantively, or not at all. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - boskonyc 11y ago
    You might have a good job, but it's probably not good enough for a decent life in New York. Either that, or you just don't know how to find quality housing in your price range. It's not easy for out of towners the first few years. Lots of mistakes :) This is one of the most desirable cities in the world. It's not the rent-stabilization that makes the city less than affordable for you.
    - cynicalkane 11y ago
      > It's not the rent-stabilization that makes the city less than affordable for you. First, this is a fallacy: in economics, things usually have multiple factors. In regards to whether rent policy is a significant factor on housing affordability for newcomers, people who study this for a living are in almost universal agreement that you're wrong.
      - deleted 11y ago
        [deleted]
busterarm 11y ago
$500 is laughably low for a rent controlled apartment in the neighborhoods where apartments are $3k. Try doubling it. For starters.
boskonyc 11y ago
The building that I currently live in in Manhattan was taken out of rent regulation (stabilization) with my lease. It's a well managed elevator building from the 70s. I'm perfectly fine paying several times more than some of the building's remaining old timers whose rents only go up 2-3% per year. My rent actually only goes up 4-5% per year. The only difference between the regulated units and mine is what would happen if the building changed owners. If a new landlord came in and was less interested in long-term quality tenants, they could dramatically raise or double my rent every year, finding newer, richer, dumber tenants -- as long as the market would tolerate it (and with the national and international interest in new york, it would). The regulated units meanwhile would continue to only raise at 2-3% per year.

busterarm 11y ago

I'm a rent-controlled tenant in a beautiful apartment building on West 55th Street. My rent is low, but not obscenely so. I lived here through the hard times when the neighborhood was shitty and filled with derelicts, winos and prostitutes. We all kept the building clean and nice. We lived in the building when _nobody wanted to live here_. We chased out the crooks who used to try to mug people in our elevator and kick open doors. The landlord made improvements to the building because the way the rent control law is designed, _they have to_ to get rent increases. And we're still here and a great tenant and great neighbors. Oh and of course the landlord has been trying all sorts of illegal means to get us (and the single-digit handful of other controlled tenants, 100+ unit building) out - and regularly gets verbally slapped around by a judge in housing court. It's a good thing we held on to hold on to _all of our records related to being in this apartment all the way back to 1970_...because we had to.

cynicalkane 11y ago
Congratulations, you got yours. Bragging about how nice your life personally is does not constitute good economics. In terms of anecdata, however, New York is famous for its shitty apartments and byzantine lending process. I don't recall ever being shown good, affordable apartment in the area where I live--and I have a good job. Bug infestations, code violations, warped walls and floors, heating systems a century old, wasteful lack of insulation running up the A/C bill and wasting energy--all these are the norm in a part of America many times more expensive than usual. If you have an everyday middle class job there's not a chance you will be able to enjoy a good apartment near the city. But I'm glad you're happy. You obviously deserve being rewarded for randomly renting the right apartment at the right time at no economic risk to yourself. It's only fitting that you use your lucky position as an excuse to exclude others as much as you can.
- busterarm 11y ago
  Yes, the <1.8% of us with _actually low_ rents (most stabilized apartments aren't nearly that low) are the reason you can't get an affordable apartment. Keep dreaming. Also, it's not just a matter of "I got mine." Living where I am afforded me class mobility that I likely would not have had in my life otherwise. I've been _dirt poor_ for most of my life, even in this apartment. What is your alternative to that? Why are you so focussed on what other people have?
  - dang 11y ago
    Both of you are breaking the HN guidelines by being personally abrasive. Please comment civilly and substantively, or not at all. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- boskonyc 11y ago
  You might have a good job, but it's probably not good enough for a decent life in New York. Either that, or you just don't know how to find quality housing in your price range. It's not easy for out of towners the first few years. Lots of mistakes :) This is one of the most desirable cities in the world. It's not the rent-stabilization that makes the city less than affordable for you.
  - cynicalkane 11y ago
    > It's not the rent-stabilization that makes the city less than affordable for you. First, this is a fallacy: in economics, things usually have multiple factors. In regards to whether rent policy is a significant factor on housing affordability for newcomers, people who study this for a living are in almost universal agreement that you're wrong.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]

busterarm 11y ago

$500 is laughably low for a rent controlled apartment in the neighborhoods where apartments are $3k. Try doubling it. For starters.

boskonyc 11y ago

The building that I currently live in in Manhattan was taken out of rent regulation (stabilization) with my lease. It's a well managed elevator building from the 70s. I'm perfectly fine paying several times more than some of the building's remaining old timers whose rents only go up 2-3% per year. My rent actually only goes up 4-5% per year. The only difference between the regulated units and mine is what would happen if the building changed owners. If a new landlord came in and was less interested in long-term quality tenants, they could dramatically raise or double my rent every year, finding newer, richer, dumber tenants -- as long as the market would tolerate it (and with the national and international interest in new york, it would). The regulated units meanwhile would continue to only raise at 2-3% per year.