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"However, web apps also allow organizations to write once for many platforms in a much more seamless way than most cross-platform native toolkits I've seen." D

"However, web apps also allow organizations to write once for many platforms in a much more seamless way than most cross-platform native toolkits I've seen." Does it? I used to think that. Until every medium-complexity or worse web project I've worked on took forever as we went through all the different browsers and OS's and now mobile and tablets and responsive and OMG just give me a decent native app tool now please. Browsers absolutely suck at UI beyond their original intended domain.

mobiuscog 11y ago
It certainly allows (some) organisations to 'believe' this. Unfortunately.
- tonyarkles 11y ago
  Ahhh, I'm with you, but not with you. There's a lot of Line of Business apps that can be written really easily as webapps. Right now my default toolkit for doing those is: Rails, Angular, Foundation. These are often pretty much just slightly-interactive forms and reports, and fit reasonably well within the browser model. These aren't profit-centric apps, these are cost-reduction apps. One of the best parts about web apps in this context is that they reduce the deployment and management costs. You don't have to worry about supporting legacy versions, nor about deploying new versions of the apps to every machine in your organization. They don't have to be perfect or beautiful, they just have to save more time and money than they cost to build and maintain.
dikaiosune 11y ago
Was this in reply to my top-level comment? Looks like this ended up a sibling instead. In reply to your comment: Perhaps, and I lack the experience and evidence to contradict you. I work solo on small to mid size projects that are mostly back-end. But I am fairly confident that with the large number of mid+ size web app projects we would be seeing a migration back to more native apps if the overhead is actually greater than maintaining multiple native apps. It's not like every company in the world is incapable of independently assessing their needs. And bandwagons will form when independently-minded companies change their processes. So why aren't we seeing a mass exodus from complex web apps? And why are many orgs using native wrappers around these supposedly terrible web apps to produce a pseudo-native app? EDIT: Also, how would you address how much easier it is to try out a web app without having to install it vs. finding, downloading, installing and running a native/mobile app?
- dkersten 11y ago
  The company I work for has a web app. Has had for years, yet have rebuilt the exact same functionality a further three times as native apps for iOS, Android and Windows Mobile. Presumably the overhead of maintaining multiple native apps (on top of the existing web app) is still cheaper for them than making the web app work for mobile. As a further anecdote, I personally don't know many people who like using web apps on their phones. I certainly don't. On my phone I use my browser to read HN and other articles and native apps for everything else. Most people I know are the same. Re: your edit - finding is no different than your web app. Downloading, your web app downloads too only everytime I load it instead of once. When installing from one of the app stores, I've never found downloading or installing any harder than clicking a button. Installing, sure, but only because the term sounds like a crazy heavyweight thing to us. The process (for mobile apps, not desktop) is generally a single click that you do once. The thing that web wins at here is that it eliminates even these few clicks, and since you don't "install" it, people feel safer and happier.

mobiuscog 11y ago

It certainly allows (some) organisations to 'believe' this. Unfortunately.

tonyarkles 11y ago
Ahhh, I'm with you, but not with you. There's a lot of Line of Business apps that can be written really easily as webapps. Right now my default toolkit for doing those is: Rails, Angular, Foundation. These are often pretty much just slightly-interactive forms and reports, and fit reasonably well within the browser model. These aren't profit-centric apps, these are cost-reduction apps. One of the best parts about web apps in this context is that they reduce the deployment and management costs. You don't have to worry about supporting legacy versions, nor about deploying new versions of the apps to every machine in your organization. They don't have to be perfect or beautiful, they just have to save more time and money than they cost to build and maintain.

dikaiosune 11y ago

Was this in reply to my top-level comment? Looks like this ended up a sibling instead. In reply to your comment: Perhaps, and I lack the experience and evidence to contradict you. I work solo on small to mid size projects that are mostly back-end. But I am fairly confident that with the large number of mid+ size web app projects we would be seeing a migration back to more native apps if the overhead is actually greater than maintaining multiple native apps. It's not like every company in the world is incapable of independently assessing their needs. And bandwagons will form when independently-minded companies change their processes. So why aren't we seeing a mass exodus from complex web apps? And why are many orgs using native wrappers around these supposedly terrible web apps to produce a pseudo-native app? EDIT: Also, how would you address how much easier it is to try out a web app without having to install it vs. finding, downloading, installing and running a native/mobile app?

dkersten 11y ago
The company I work for has a web app. Has had for years, yet have rebuilt the exact same functionality a further three times as native apps for iOS, Android and Windows Mobile. Presumably the overhead of maintaining multiple native apps (on top of the existing web app) is still cheaper for them than making the web app work for mobile. As a further anecdote, I personally don't know many people who like using web apps on their phones. I certainly don't. On my phone I use my browser to read HN and other articles and native apps for everything else. Most people I know are the same. Re: your edit - finding is no different than your web app. Downloading, your web app downloads too only everytime I load it instead of once. When installing from one of the app stores, I've never found downloading or installing any harder than clicking a button. Installing, sure, but only because the term sounds like a crazy heavyweight thing to us. The process (for mobile apps, not desktop) is generally a single click that you do once. The thing that web wins at here is that it eliminates even these few clicks, and since you don't "install" it, people feel safer and happier.