5 ms·

If one of the problems they're trying to fix is not being able to iterate as fast as they'd like then rewriting the entireity of a ten year old game isn't going

If one of the problems they're trying to fix is not being able to iterate as fast as they'd like then rewriting the entireity of a ten year old game isn't going to help that.

enraged_camel 11y ago
That's what I'm saying though: they aren't able to iterate quickly because it's a huge codebase written in a programming language that is quite complex and fairly outdated. Besides, I'd assume that intermediate and experienced C++ developers are probably older on average, and are unlikely to be interested in developing games.
- AdieuToLogic 11y ago
  You would assume incorrectly.
  - enraged_camel 11y ago
    Why is that? C++ is over 30 years old, whereas JavaScript is 20 years old. Besides, the latter surged in popularity only recently. Based on these facts alone, we can comfortably assume that experienced C++ developers are older on average. I can see why this is a controversial assumption though.
    - mattmanser 11y ago
      Seriously, please drop it. Javascript is not used to code games much, C++ is. Javascript is pretty awful performance wise. Also, porting a whole code base to another language at this stage in the game is such a colossal task. Are you even a developer? I'm not sure you realise how infeasible what you're suggesting is.
      - irascible 11y ago
        emscripten would like to have a word with you. Also, Javascript is one of the most heavily optimized dynamic languages in existence, and has orders of magnitude more code and programmers using/written in it, than java, scala, ruby, lua, etc. Rewriting any game in javascript is imho a great idea. (I am a C/C++ game developer with ~25 years of experience.)
        obstinate 11y ago
        Orders of magnitude more code written in it than Java? Hohoho good one. HTH: http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.... http://githut.info http://githut.info
        irascible 11y ago
        Java may have been a stretch.. but think about how many web apps have been written.. and consider that a large %age of user time is spent in the browser who's language IS javascript.. Ive removed java from my systems since oracle ganked it. Java is used in lots of business/banking software, true.. but even the tiobe charts u linked show it declining in popularity.. contrasting w js being language of the year 2014. As for the other DYNAMIC languages.. it's no contest.
        obstinate 11y ago
        It wasn't a "stretch." It was flat out wrong.
        simoncion 11y ago
        > Rewriting any game in javascript is imho a great idea. How do you deal with the fact that the only native numeric type is a 64bit float? Space Engineers currently uses floats as the basis for their world coordinate system. Things get really bumpy when you get far away from [0,0,0].
        irascible 11y ago
      - honest_joe 11y ago
        This is not a game that requires the level of precision one would get with C++ (yet it sucks performance wise even when it's being programmed in C++).
    - AdieuToLogic 11y ago
      Your stated assumption was: I'd assume that intermediate and experienced C++ developers are probably older on average, and are unlikely to be interested in developing games. And that is an incorrect assumption. A non-trivial amount of current game development is done in C++. Couple that with the fact that to have the games considered "AAA" on the market now requires advanced techniques employed in the language producing them and that C++ is a frequent choice results in the invalidation of your statement (not harshing you here BTW). It doesn't hurt my case that I am an experienced "advanced C++" developer which makes video games either tho ;-).
    - TeMPOraL 11y ago
      Older on average than JS programmers, that's a reasonable assumption if you also assume that the "surge in popularity" brought a ton of kids to JS. But that they're older in general on average (i.e. not a lot of young C++ developers)? I would doubt that. Moreover, C++ isn't outdated, it's mature. There aren't any grand new CS discoveries that are in JS but C++ maintainers haven't heard of yet. As for "older = unlikely to be interested in developing games", I don't see where you get that from. It's like saying "older people are unlikely to be interested in writing books / making movies".
    - xorcist 11y ago
      Because you only learn a language at a certain age, and only if the language in question is brand new? That's doesn't make sense (and that's an understatement to be nice).
LoSboccacc 11y ago
another of the problem is that they need more polish and fixing and there aren't major captivating features in the works, and it's hard to bring unpaid volunteers on board with that prospect in mind.

If one of the problems they're trying to fix is not being able to iterate as fast as they'd like then rewriting the entireity of a ten year old game isn't going to help that.

enraged_camel 11y ago

That's what I'm saying though: they aren't able to iterate quickly because it's a huge codebase written in a programming language that is quite complex and fairly outdated. Besides, I'd assume that intermediate and experienced C++ developers are probably older on average, and are unlikely to be interested in developing games.

AdieuToLogic 11y ago
You would assume incorrectly.
- enraged_camel 11y ago
  Why is that? C++ is over 30 years old, whereas JavaScript is 20 years old. Besides, the latter surged in popularity only recently. Based on these facts alone, we can comfortably assume that experienced C++ developers are older on average. I can see why this is a controversial assumption though.
  - mattmanser 11y ago
    Seriously, please drop it. Javascript is not used to code games much, C++ is. Javascript is pretty awful performance wise. Also, porting a whole code base to another language at this stage in the game is such a colossal task. Are you even a developer? I'm not sure you realise how infeasible what you're suggesting is.
    - irascible 11y ago
      emscripten would like to have a word with you. Also, Javascript is one of the most heavily optimized dynamic languages in existence, and has orders of magnitude more code and programmers using/written in it, than java, scala, ruby, lua, etc. Rewriting any game in javascript is imho a great idea. (I am a C/C++ game developer with ~25 years of experience.)
      - obstinate 11y ago
        Orders of magnitude more code written in it than Java? Hohoho good one. HTH: http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.... http://githut.info http://githut.info
        irascible 11y ago
        Java may have been a stretch.. but think about how many web apps have been written.. and consider that a large %age of user time is spent in the browser who's language IS javascript.. Ive removed java from my systems since oracle ganked it. Java is used in lots of business/banking software, true.. but even the tiobe charts u linked show it declining in popularity.. contrasting w js being language of the year 2014. As for the other DYNAMIC languages.. it's no contest.
        obstinate 11y ago
        It wasn't a "stretch." It was flat out wrong.
      - simoncion 11y ago
        > Rewriting any game in javascript is imho a great idea. How do you deal with the fact that the only native numeric type is a 64bit float? Space Engineers currently uses floats as the basis for their world coordinate system. Things get really bumpy when you get far away from [0,0,0].
        irascible 11y ago
    - honest_joe 11y ago
      This is not a game that requires the level of precision one would get with C++ (yet it sucks performance wise even when it's being programmed in C++).
  - AdieuToLogic 11y ago
    Your stated assumption was: I'd assume that intermediate and experienced C++ developers are probably older on average, and are unlikely to be interested in developing games. And that is an incorrect assumption. A non-trivial amount of current game development is done in C++. Couple that with the fact that to have the games considered "AAA" on the market now requires advanced techniques employed in the language producing them and that C++ is a frequent choice results in the invalidation of your statement (not harshing you here BTW). It doesn't hurt my case that I am an experienced "advanced C++" developer which makes video games either tho ;-).
  - TeMPOraL 11y ago
    Older on average than JS programmers, that's a reasonable assumption if you also assume that the "surge in popularity" brought a ton of kids to JS. But that they're older in general on average (i.e. not a lot of young C++ developers)? I would doubt that. Moreover, C++ isn't outdated, it's mature. There aren't any grand new CS discoveries that are in JS but C++ maintainers haven't heard of yet. As for "older = unlikely to be interested in developing games", I don't see where you get that from. It's like saying "older people are unlikely to be interested in writing books / making movies".
  - xorcist 11y ago
    Because you only learn a language at a certain age, and only if the language in question is brand new? That's doesn't make sense (and that's an understatement to be nice).

LoSboccacc 11y ago

another of the problem is that they need more polish and fixing and there aren't major captivating features in the works, and it's hard to bring unpaid volunteers on board with that prospect in mind.