5 ms·

Whenever my imagination starts to run wild with the possibility of a huge announcement of this variety, I always like to remember what Terence McKenna said abou

by jMyles 11y ago

Whenever my imagination starts to run wild with the possibility of a huge announcement of this variety, I always like to remember what Terence McKenna said about this: "if aliens were to land on the front lawn of the white house tomorrow, it would not change the fact that the weirdest thing in the universe is DMT."

motoboi 11y ago
Could you elaborate on what is so weird on that molecule?
- dogma1138 11y ago
  It's a psychedelic type substance similar to LSD. What he meant is that the weirdest things you can ever experience is you on acid.
  - resolutionx 11y ago
    I wouldn't be so quick to say the two are identical. It's different for everyone obviously but they are very different psychedelic experiences for most. DMT is VERY powerful when administered correctly. Regardless this is a bit off topic.
  - maaku 11y ago
    Eh, I guess it's a matter of personal perspective. Anything in a hallucination is a hallucination. It's not constraint to conform to reality. For something to be REAL and weird automatically puts it on another level.
- jMyles 11y ago
  He says it in a few different ways in his lectures, but he believed that the psychedelic experience is so strange and full of content that, even if aliens landed on the White House lawn and it made the biggest story in the history of news, it's still not as astonishing as human neurochemistry. I'm not sure I agree, but I think it's good to keep this perspective in mind any time we find ourselves tempted to think of something as 'the biggest thing ever.'
  - myderpyaccount 11y ago
    Reality is really weird though. I really keep trying to think whether aliens existing would actually radically change my life, individually. On one hand, maybe, but on the other, probably not (and this is more likely). I feel like I already experience my existence like I am alien to everything that is not me, whether it is talking to a cat or a person or a tree, the whole thing is like 'reality blob' that I am not really sure how all of this happened, nor do I ever have any hope whatsoever of finding the answer to that question. When I wonder thoughts to myself I wonder who it is that thinks the question and who it is that responds with an answer. So many thinkings are just permutations of what has already been heard, and they form patterns and it's really weird. It's easy to get 'used to things' and 'acclimated to things', I just feel like I have it hardwired in me to perpetually be weirded out by my own existence. Complexity doesn't even describe it, strange doesn't either, as these are all human concepts. You really just have to learn to observe with a completely blank mind. Then it's just like being in this interface that's always super weird and confusing, and it's ridiculous how some people really think they know what they are doing (like in their deepest philosophical and spiritual core, not like 'have to go to work today to feed the kids').
    - novoid 11y ago
      Sartre's Nausea and Hesse's Steppenwolf tackles this theme beautifully.
- d-equivalence 11y ago
  It is weird because it is present in many "mundane" plants and in the human organism, allegedly released at the time of death. It lasts 10 minutes which is strange for a psychedelic substance, which after the experience you can go back as Terrence said "answering phonecalls". Apparently the human body knows perfectly well how to metabolize it completely without any taxing effects. From my personal experience in psychedelics, all of them, LSD, mushrooms and so forth, the user still maintains a reference point to reality around him however weird it might look. With DMT, the whole content of present reality disappears and you are seemingly transported in a completely different reality booming with alien intelligence (described by DMT users as self transforming machine elves) that purportedly is also very happy to see you "broken through". Users also report an incredible amount of information being transmitted to them, albeit completely indescribable by present human language and concepts and find themselves being under a dome-like structure (called the "DMT Dome"). From what I know, these effects are only present if you follow a specific dosage and no less than that. Another strange fact is that while all other psychedelics are boundary dissolving substances with your ego first to get booted, with DMT you apparently "maintain" your present self throughout the trip. This is what the "Death by astonishment" quote of the same author, refers to.
  - myth_buster 11y ago
    Ah, the white light at the end, the flow of knowledge, being close to the all-knowing and other statements as described by those who had near-death-experiences. This seems logical and is quite fascinating. Thanks for describing it in detail.
    - d-equivalence 11y ago
      There are several parallels depending on how far down the rabbit hole you want to go. Reports of feeling accepted and loved, and the "tone" sound in the beginning which seems to me really similar with the one you hear when you astrally project out of your body. But we are fast getting out of HN accepted topics of discussion so.. :-) Ultimately one should (not must) explore these things on his/her own instead of reading it on the web. All this quickly degenerates to entertainment if one only reads about them online.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
nerd_stuff 11y ago
By all accounts NASA's getting ready to announce they've found an earth-like planet and you guys are like "yeah but I'm sure it won't compare the experience of taking my favorite drug." That's a sad and closed-minded way of looking at things. It reminds me of Jon Stewart's character in Half Baked who thought everything was better "on weeeeed!" If your drug of choice prevents you from enjoying other experiences, like staring in wonder at the mysteries of the universe, that's like being in an abusive relationship. There's no good reason the existence of a drug should prevent you from enjoying an announcement like this. There's definitely no good reason to assume that in this 16 billion year old universe which you've been part of for a negligible amount of time, which you've physically experienced only a negligible amount of, that you've already found the weirdest or most interesting thing ever.
- d-equivalence 11y ago
  The psychedelic experience is the most intense experience anyone can have on this planet, and it cannot be compared or described by anything else one has experienced in his/her life. Surely there's no good reason to assume anything but you do assume and in the most cliche way. Maybe first you should chuck 5 gramms of dried mushrooms with some lemonade and come back and tells us what you think after that. I'm not sure if the parent was advocating or saying this. It was in reference to Terrence Mckenna's view of the present assumptions that mankind has about what aliens should look like and how one should go about contacting them (and that DMT and mushrooms are probably an alien artifact). And certainly one can lose the plot and spend his entire life tripping. Noone is saying thats a good thing.
  - nerd_stuff 11y ago
    > ...and it cannot be compared or described by anything else one has experienced in his/her life Many long-term meditators who have previous experience with psychedelics would disagree with you. I'm only making the assumption of agnosticism, that it's fundamentally impossible for you to know that something already within your realm of experience will trump all that exists in the unknown.

by jMyles 11y ago

motoboi 11y ago

Could you elaborate on what is so weird on that molecule?

dogma1138 11y ago
It's a psychedelic type substance similar to LSD. What he meant is that the weirdest things you can ever experience is you on acid.
- resolutionx 11y ago
  I wouldn't be so quick to say the two are identical. It's different for everyone obviously but they are very different psychedelic experiences for most. DMT is VERY powerful when administered correctly. Regardless this is a bit off topic.
- maaku 11y ago
  Eh, I guess it's a matter of personal perspective. Anything in a hallucination is a hallucination. It's not constraint to conform to reality. For something to be REAL and weird automatically puts it on another level.
jMyles 11y ago
He says it in a few different ways in his lectures, but he believed that the psychedelic experience is so strange and full of content that, even if aliens landed on the White House lawn and it made the biggest story in the history of news, it's still not as astonishing as human neurochemistry. I'm not sure I agree, but I think it's good to keep this perspective in mind any time we find ourselves tempted to think of something as 'the biggest thing ever.'
- myderpyaccount 11y ago
  Reality is really weird though. I really keep trying to think whether aliens existing would actually radically change my life, individually. On one hand, maybe, but on the other, probably not (and this is more likely). I feel like I already experience my existence like I am alien to everything that is not me, whether it is talking to a cat or a person or a tree, the whole thing is like 'reality blob' that I am not really sure how all of this happened, nor do I ever have any hope whatsoever of finding the answer to that question. When I wonder thoughts to myself I wonder who it is that thinks the question and who it is that responds with an answer. So many thinkings are just permutations of what has already been heard, and they form patterns and it's really weird. It's easy to get 'used to things' and 'acclimated to things', I just feel like I have it hardwired in me to perpetually be weirded out by my own existence. Complexity doesn't even describe it, strange doesn't either, as these are all human concepts. You really just have to learn to observe with a completely blank mind. Then it's just like being in this interface that's always super weird and confusing, and it's ridiculous how some people really think they know what they are doing (like in their deepest philosophical and spiritual core, not like 'have to go to work today to feed the kids').
  - novoid 11y ago
    Sartre's Nausea and Hesse's Steppenwolf tackles this theme beautifully.
d-equivalence 11y ago
It is weird because it is present in many "mundane" plants and in the human organism, allegedly released at the time of death. It lasts 10 minutes which is strange for a psychedelic substance, which after the experience you can go back as Terrence said "answering phonecalls". Apparently the human body knows perfectly well how to metabolize it completely without any taxing effects. From my personal experience in psychedelics, all of them, LSD, mushrooms and so forth, the user still maintains a reference point to reality around him however weird it might look. With DMT, the whole content of present reality disappears and you are seemingly transported in a completely different reality booming with alien intelligence (described by DMT users as self transforming machine elves) that purportedly is also very happy to see you "broken through". Users also report an incredible amount of information being transmitted to them, albeit completely indescribable by present human language and concepts and find themselves being under a dome-like structure (called the "DMT Dome"). From what I know, these effects are only present if you follow a specific dosage and no less than that. Another strange fact is that while all other psychedelics are boundary dissolving substances with your ego first to get booted, with DMT you apparently "maintain" your present self throughout the trip. This is what the "Death by astonishment" quote of the same author, refers to.
- myth_buster 11y ago
  Ah, the white light at the end, the flow of knowledge, being close to the all-knowing and other statements as described by those who had near-death-experiences. This seems logical and is quite fascinating. Thanks for describing it in detail.
  - d-equivalence 11y ago
    There are several parallels depending on how far down the rabbit hole you want to go. Reports of feeling accepted and loved, and the "tone" sound in the beginning which seems to me really similar with the one you hear when you astrally project out of your body. But we are fast getting out of HN accepted topics of discussion so.. :-) Ultimately one should (not must) explore these things on his/her own instead of reading it on the web. All this quickly degenerates to entertainment if one only reads about them online.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

nerd_stuff 11y ago

By all accounts NASA's getting ready to announce they've found an earth-like planet and you guys are like "yeah but I'm sure it won't compare the experience of taking my favorite drug." That's a sad and closed-minded way of looking at things. It reminds me of Jon Stewart's character in Half Baked who thought everything was better "on weeeeed!" If your drug of choice prevents you from enjoying other experiences, like staring in wonder at the mysteries of the universe, that's like being in an abusive relationship. There's no good reason the existence of a drug should prevent you from enjoying an announcement like this. There's definitely no good reason to assume that in this 16 billion year old universe which you've been part of for a negligible amount of time, which you've physically experienced only a negligible amount of, that you've already found the weirdest or most interesting thing ever.

d-equivalence 11y ago
The psychedelic experience is the most intense experience anyone can have on this planet, and it cannot be compared or described by anything else one has experienced in his/her life. Surely there's no good reason to assume anything but you do assume and in the most cliche way. Maybe first you should chuck 5 gramms of dried mushrooms with some lemonade and come back and tells us what you think after that. I'm not sure if the parent was advocating or saying this. It was in reference to Terrence Mckenna's view of the present assumptions that mankind has about what aliens should look like and how one should go about contacting them (and that DMT and mushrooms are probably an alien artifact). And certainly one can lose the plot and spend his entire life tripping. Noone is saying thats a good thing.
- nerd_stuff 11y ago
  > ...and it cannot be compared or described by anything else one has experienced in his/her life Many long-term meditators who have previous experience with psychedelics would disagree with you. I'm only making the assumption of agnosticism, that it's fundamentally impossible for you to know that something already within your realm of experience will trump all that exists in the unknown.