4 ms·

(native german speaker here) I also have an issue with the sensationalist reporting of "treason" charges. "Treason" is a correct translation for "Landesverrat

(native german speaker here) I also have an issue with the sensationalist reporting of "treason" charges. "Treason" is a correct translation for "Landesverrat" ("land treason"), similar to "high treason" being "Hochverrat". The thing is, for all I can tell, there are no "Landesverrat" (StGB §94) charges. If anything, there would be charges for the lesser act of "disclosure of state secrets" (StGB §95, right below) Yet, the press speaks of "Geheimnisverrat" (disclosure of secrets): http://www.zeit.de/politik/deutschland/2015-07/verfassungsschutz-geheimdienst-hans-georg-maassen-praesident-anzeige http://www.zeit.de/politik/deutschland/2015-07/verfassungssc... That would most likely be the §353b you mention. I don't think it would be controversial to consider the disclosure of secret documents as what it is: disclosure of secret documents. However, even with prosecution under §353b there is still the requirement of "threatening important public interest". These seem to be ordinary (and expected) legal proceedings, no need to blow it out of proportion.

rbehrends 11y ago
> (native german speaker here) Note: I'm also a native speaker of German. > "Treason" is a correct translation for "Landesverrat" ("land treason"), similar to "high treason" being "Hochverrat". "Landesverrat" is the crime of communicating state secrets to a foreign power; this does not match the definition of "treason" that you find in English dictionaries [1]. "Hochverrat" is a closer equivalent of "treason". Just because "Verrat" can mean "treason" (but also "betrayal", "treachery", "perfidy", etc.) does not mean that "Landesverrat" describes the same legal concept. We're looking at a false friend. In fact, even the German Wikipedia page describes "Landesverrat" as a form of espionage: "Das Delikt des Landesverrates ist die Kernstraftat der Spionage." > Yet, the press speaks of "Geheimnisverrat" (disclosure of secrets) The press says all kinds of things, presumably because nobody knows exactly what's going on. What we do know is that the German Federal Prosecutor is investigating, and he does not have the power to prosecute "Geheimnisverrat" per §353b StGB [2]. As I said, the reporting is extremely muddled. [1] E.g.: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/treason http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/treason [2] https://www.generalbundesanwalt.de/de/zust.php https://www.generalbundesanwalt.de/de/zust.php
- baertram 11y ago
  I don't fully agree with the classification as a false friend. "Landesverrat" describes an act of information disclosure so grave and dangerous that it would fall under "treason" in many jurisdictions: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treason http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treason Less strong forms of "mere" espionage are also covered in §96-§99 StGB. As for your comment on the Federal Prosecutor: I'm not an expert on the legal system, but I would expect that he can file charges (like everyone else) according to whatever his investigations turned up with. I don't see how your link says otherwise.

rbehrends 11y ago

> (native german speaker here) Note: I'm also a native speaker of German. > "Treason" is a correct translation for "Landesverrat" ("land treason"), similar to "high treason" being "Hochverrat". "Landesverrat" is the crime of communicating state secrets to a foreign power; this does not match the definition of "treason" that you find in English dictionaries [1]. "Hochverrat" is a closer equivalent of "treason". Just because "Verrat" can mean "treason" (but also "betrayal", "treachery", "perfidy", etc.) does not mean that "Landesverrat" describes the same legal concept. We're looking at a false friend. In fact, even the German Wikipedia page describes "Landesverrat" as a form of espionage: "Das Delikt des Landesverrates ist die Kernstraftat der Spionage." > Yet, the press speaks of "Geheimnisverrat" (disclosure of secrets) The press says all kinds of things, presumably because nobody knows exactly what's going on. What we do know is that the German Federal Prosecutor is investigating, and he does not have the power to prosecute "Geheimnisverrat" per §353b StGB [2]. As I said, the reporting is extremely muddled. [1] E.g.: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/treason http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/treason [2] https://www.generalbundesanwalt.de/de/zust.php https://www.generalbundesanwalt.de/de/zust.php

baertram 11y ago
I don't fully agree with the classification as a false friend. "Landesverrat" describes an act of information disclosure so grave and dangerous that it would fall under "treason" in many jurisdictions: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treason http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treason Less strong forms of "mere" espionage are also covered in §96-§99 StGB. As for your comment on the Federal Prosecutor: I'm not an expert on the legal system, but I would expect that he can file charges (like everyone else) according to whatever his investigations turned up with. I don't see how your link says otherwise.