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So you really think that all of the people recently murdered by police officers would be fine if they had just "behaved"?

freehunter 11y ago
All? No. He never said all, and that's an unfair way you're phrasing the argument. You're deliberately setting it up so that anyone who disagrees with you is immediately painted as blaming the victim. That's not what this discussion is about and you know it, so shame on you. He said you're more likely to. But in some cases, the situation could have been improved to the point where the outcome could have been completely different if the person had complied with the officer. I'm not saying the cop was right in any of the cases, but if I see a semi truck barreling down the freeway into oncoming traffic... I have the right-of-way because I'm in the correct lane, but you'd better believe I'm going to get out of that truck's way. Because absolute best case result there is that I will die a quick and painless death. I was in Madison WI when Tony Robinson was killed and saw some of the protests against the police. It was interesting to me that the spirit of the protests weren't harmed by the fact that Tony had assaulted people on the street then tried to kill the police officer responding to the incident. Sitting in jail innocent and alive is always better in my book than being gunned down in the street by a scared and trigger-happy cop.
- thomnottom 11y ago
  Shame on me? Bull. Plain and simple. The commenter completely painted the victim in the wrong here. If cops are comparable to semis baring down on the freeway then we need to abolish them completely because they are out of control. And playing nice isn't going to change that. Sitting in jail innocent and alive should not be the lesser of two evils.
  - freehunter 11y ago
    Again, you're framing it as a black and white, this or that argument. It's not. Cops abusing their power is wrong. People refusing to follow the orders of police officers is wrong. Arresting someone for contempt of cop is wrong. Resisting arrest is wrong. Driving a semi the wrong way down the road is wrong. Not swerving to avoid the semi is wrong. If an officer wants to arrest you and you start becoming physically violent, you are in the wrong. At that point it doesn't matter that the cop was wrong first, because you're already dead. Now, if your goal is to become a martyr for your cause, then you've just hit the jackpot. If your goal is to take another breath, to see your loved ones one more time... becoming physically violent with a cop is a really bad idea. Is this the way it should be? No, we shouldn't be afraid of police officers. But for better or worse, this is how it is. Your platitudes about "cops are bad, the victim is right" isn't entirely realistic unless the goal is to create more martyrs.
- justaman 11y ago
  We know how to protest in Madison!
joshuaheard 11y ago
Yes. In nearly all these stories, the victim is resisting arrest in one form or another. The moral of the story is: don't resist arrest. Respect the police and follow their orders. If you have an issue, take it up with the judge later.
- thomnottom 11y ago
  How can someone resist arrest when they are not being arrested?

freehunter 11y ago

All? No. He never said all, and that's an unfair way you're phrasing the argument. You're deliberately setting it up so that anyone who disagrees with you is immediately painted as blaming the victim. That's not what this discussion is about and you know it, so shame on you. He said you're more likely to. But in some cases, the situation could have been improved to the point where the outcome could have been completely different if the person had complied with the officer. I'm not saying the cop was right in any of the cases, but if I see a semi truck barreling down the freeway into oncoming traffic... I have the right-of-way because I'm in the correct lane, but you'd better believe I'm going to get out of that truck's way. Because absolute best case result there is that I will die a quick and painless death. I was in Madison WI when Tony Robinson was killed and saw some of the protests against the police. It was interesting to me that the spirit of the protests weren't harmed by the fact that Tony had assaulted people on the street then tried to kill the police officer responding to the incident. Sitting in jail innocent and alive is always better in my book than being gunned down in the street by a scared and trigger-happy cop.

thomnottom 11y ago
Shame on me? Bull. Plain and simple. The commenter completely painted the victim in the wrong here. If cops are comparable to semis baring down on the freeway then we need to abolish them completely because they are out of control. And playing nice isn't going to change that. Sitting in jail innocent and alive should not be the lesser of two evils.
- freehunter 11y ago
  Again, you're framing it as a black and white, this or that argument. It's not. Cops abusing their power is wrong. People refusing to follow the orders of police officers is wrong. Arresting someone for contempt of cop is wrong. Resisting arrest is wrong. Driving a semi the wrong way down the road is wrong. Not swerving to avoid the semi is wrong. If an officer wants to arrest you and you start becoming physically violent, you are in the wrong. At that point it doesn't matter that the cop was wrong first, because you're already dead. Now, if your goal is to become a martyr for your cause, then you've just hit the jackpot. If your goal is to take another breath, to see your loved ones one more time... becoming physically violent with a cop is a really bad idea. Is this the way it should be? No, we shouldn't be afraid of police officers. But for better or worse, this is how it is. Your platitudes about "cops are bad, the victim is right" isn't entirely realistic unless the goal is to create more martyrs.
justaman 11y ago
We know how to protest in Madison!

joshuaheard 11y ago

Yes. In nearly all these stories, the victim is resisting arrest in one form or another. The moral of the story is: don't resist arrest. Respect the police and follow their orders. If you have an issue, take it up with the judge later.

thomnottom 11y ago
How can someone resist arrest when they are not being arrested?