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MS Access - Learn it first! Why? The first few reasons that come to mind: 1) To quote a friend of mine, “If a 50 year old boilermaker can work it out, then a

MS Access - Learn it first! Why? The first few reasons that come to mind: 1) To quote a friend of mine, “If a 50 year old boilermaker can work it out, then anyone can.” 2) MS Access will more than likely be installed on your computer at work. 3) Almost all "startup" type programs will need databasing of some sort. 4) It has macros and modules (VBA - Visual Basic for Applications) 5) As you start to learn Visual Basic for Application you can use this to potentially automate things at work as it available across Word and Excel. Read these to get started: Database basics [1] This article provides a brief overview of databases -- what they are, why you might want to use one, and what the different parts of a database do. Database design basics [2] A properly designed database provides you with access to up-to-date, accurate information. Learn the structure of an Access database [3] Becoming familiar with the tables, forms, queries, and other objects in a database can make it easier to perform a wide variety of tasks, such as entering data into a form, adding or removing tables, finding and replacing data, and running queries. [1] https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Database-basics-2C57449A-4232-44BD-B090-EF01058ED1F1 https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Database-basics-2C5... [2] https://support.office.com/en-gb/article/Database-design-basics-eb2159cf-1e30-401a-8084-bd4f9c9ca1f5 https://support.office.com/en-gb/article/Database-design-bas... [3] https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Learn-the-structure-of-an-Access-database-6A95097A-F95C-45BF-BE9B-A3F8D7D61C1D https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Learn-the-structure...

halflings 11y ago
This is... some pretty weird advice. Learn MS Access first? Really? First, it's just a database system coupled with macros. That's not the most important thing you'll want to learn if you want to build a startup. The frontend and/or backend logic are the most interesting, not "macros" to run on your database. Then, VBA is pretty horrible for a beginner and he's probably going to want to deploy his service at some point (and MS solutions are not exactly the easiest to deploy for a beginner)
- richardboegli 11y ago
  > This is... some pretty weird advice. Learn MS Access first? Really? Yes, really. He needs to learn the fundamentals. Read my post again and see the points I made. > Then, VBA is pretty horrible for a beginner and he's probably going to want to deploy his service at some point (and MS solutions are not exactly the easiest to deploy for a beginner) I've was able to deploy an MS Access database on Sharepoint in about 5 minutes.
tajen 11y ago
If the other comment isn't enough, I say -1 to Access too. Please head straight to real technologies that will allow you to make things, e.g. HTML/CSS/JS, and whatever back-end you like (PHP, Java, Node...).
- richardboegli 11y ago
  > Please head straight to real technologies that will allow you to make things A BASIC language in any RAD would serve him best to LEARN. Flow control is a fundamental, this can be learnt in any language.
adjohu 11y ago
... Don't do this.
- richardboegli 11y ago
  > ... Don't do this. Care to elaborate further?
richardboegli 11y ago
Responding to myself as there are quite a few comments to respond to: I knew that I would get this response on HN, which is why I knew I needed to post it as no one else would. Don’t worry about the technology, learn how to code. Actually learn how to develop software and the fundamentals of follow control: IF ELSE WHILE FOR etc… When I studied Software Engineering, our lecturer told us “Only 10% of the software development is coding.” I was initially shocked with that statement, but when you take into account requirements analysis, design, testing, support etc… it is about right. But a lot of programmers "do this on the fly", so they don't objectively think about it. I would actually also recommend learning C# using Visual Studio Community as well, also learn Javascript and SQL. But not as your first languages. VBA in MS Access is not as slick as Visual Basic 6 was, I will agree on that. No, I’m not a Microsoft shill. I’ve just been around long enough and have worked with many different languages, stacks and within many different industries. I’m just not a very social person (still not) and have kept a very small attributable presence on the internet. I was advised that I needed to be a bit more visible now because of my book (40in40book.com), but most of my software development work is under nicknames or in private industry and not publically attributable to me. :) Note: I know the wordpress site for my book is not the best, but I have other more important things to spend my time and money on.
andy_ppp 11y ago
This is terrible advice! Please learn JavaScript, HTML and CSS first! I know that in some places front end is considered not as important as backend - it can be simpler but learning the basics here will allow you to create prototypes for your ideas. Best of luck - let us know how you are doing in 6 months :-)
- touristtam 11y ago
  I agree with andy_ppp on the combo html/javascript/css. There are plenty of places to experiment online with this stack, and it can be used for both back-end and front-end. And with node-webkit or similar is can also be used for desktop applications. And javascript is flexible enough that you can use different programming paradigm, depending on your own preferences.
anon3_ 11y ago
Fair, in startups, we often embrace open source solutions. I myself, wouldn't want to bother with Microsoft, but many stake their careers on their technologies. It works. There is a whole network of people who with jobs using Microsoft tools. It's perfectly justifiable.
- jqm 11y ago
  Sure. But this guy wants to learn coding and do startups. Not make spreadsheets for the company.
jqm 11y ago
Take this posters advice and do _exactly_ the opposite. Don't start with with relying on clicky drag things. Take the time to become comfortable with command line. Learn real database concepts. I recommend looking at some books and playing around with Sqlite and staying far far far away from MS Access unless you want to work in corporate accounting or something.
jschwartzi 11y ago
The first professional experience that I got in software development involved maintaining a rickety old Access database for the service department I was in. I added a bunch of stuff to it and learned quite a lot. It's not very sexy at all but it did get me noticed.
aaronbasssett 11y ago
I can't tell if serious or the best troll I've seen in a while. To the OP, don't do this. This is the equivalent of letting a White Van Man[1] teach you how to drive. Sure they can get you from A to B, and yeah they might even get paid for doing it. But you'll pick up so many bad habits that any other driver you have to work with will think you're an idiot and completely distrust you. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_van_man https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_van_man

halflings 11y ago

This is... some pretty weird advice. Learn MS Access first? Really? First, it's just a database system coupled with macros. That's not the most important thing you'll want to learn if you want to build a startup. The frontend and/or backend logic are the most interesting, not "macros" to run on your database. Then, VBA is pretty horrible for a beginner and he's probably going to want to deploy his service at some point (and MS solutions are not exactly the easiest to deploy for a beginner)

richardboegli 11y ago
> This is... some pretty weird advice. Learn MS Access first? Really? Yes, really. He needs to learn the fundamentals. Read my post again and see the points I made. > Then, VBA is pretty horrible for a beginner and he's probably going to want to deploy his service at some point (and MS solutions are not exactly the easiest to deploy for a beginner) I've was able to deploy an MS Access database on Sharepoint in about 5 minutes.

tajen 11y ago

If the other comment isn't enough, I say -1 to Access too. Please head straight to real technologies that will allow you to make things, e.g. HTML/CSS/JS, and whatever back-end you like (PHP, Java, Node...).

richardboegli 11y ago
> Please head straight to real technologies that will allow you to make things A BASIC language in any RAD would serve him best to LEARN. Flow control is a fundamental, this can be learnt in any language.

adjohu 11y ago

... Don't do this.

richardboegli 11y ago
> ... Don't do this. Care to elaborate further?

richardboegli 11y ago

Responding to myself as there are quite a few comments to respond to: I knew that I would get this response on HN, which is why I knew I needed to post it as no one else would. Don’t worry about the technology, learn how to code. Actually learn how to develop software and the fundamentals of follow control: IF ELSE WHILE FOR etc… When I studied Software Engineering, our lecturer told us “Only 10% of the software development is coding.” I was initially shocked with that statement, but when you take into account requirements analysis, design, testing, support etc… it is about right. But a lot of programmers "do this on the fly", so they don't objectively think about it. I would actually also recommend learning C# using Visual Studio Community as well, also learn Javascript and SQL. But not as your first languages. VBA in MS Access is not as slick as Visual Basic 6 was, I will agree on that. No, I’m not a Microsoft shill. I’ve just been around long enough and have worked with many different languages, stacks and within many different industries. I’m just not a very social person (still not) and have kept a very small attributable presence on the internet. I was advised that I needed to be a bit more visible now because of my book (40in40book.com), but most of my software development work is under nicknames or in private industry and not publically attributable to me. :) Note: I know the wordpress site for my book is not the best, but I have other more important things to spend my time and money on.

andy_ppp 11y ago

This is terrible advice! Please learn JavaScript, HTML and CSS first! I know that in some places front end is considered not as important as backend - it can be simpler but learning the basics here will allow you to create prototypes for your ideas. Best of luck - let us know how you are doing in 6 months :-)

touristtam 11y ago
I agree with andy_ppp on the combo html/javascript/css. There are plenty of places to experiment online with this stack, and it can be used for both back-end and front-end. And with node-webkit or similar is can also be used for desktop applications. And javascript is flexible enough that you can use different programming paradigm, depending on your own preferences.

anon3_ 11y ago

Fair, in startups, we often embrace open source solutions. I myself, wouldn't want to bother with Microsoft, but many stake their careers on their technologies. It works. There is a whole network of people who with jobs using Microsoft tools. It's perfectly justifiable.

jqm 11y ago
Sure. But this guy wants to learn coding and do startups. Not make spreadsheets for the company.

jqm 11y ago

Take this posters advice and do _exactly_ the opposite. Don't start with with relying on clicky drag things. Take the time to become comfortable with command line. Learn real database concepts. I recommend looking at some books and playing around with Sqlite and staying far far far away from MS Access unless you want to work in corporate accounting or something.

jschwartzi 11y ago

The first professional experience that I got in software development involved maintaining a rickety old Access database for the service department I was in. I added a bunch of stuff to it and learned quite a lot. It's not very sexy at all but it did get me noticed.

aaronbasssett 11y ago

I can't tell if serious or the best troll I've seen in a while. To the OP, don't do this. This is the equivalent of letting a White Van Man[1] teach you how to drive. Sure they can get you from A to B, and yeah they might even get paid for doing it. But you'll pick up so many bad habits that any other driver you have to work with will think you're an idiot and completely distrust you. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_van_man https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_van_man