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Strange that this is coming from telerik, a company that creates really heavy and closed javascript framework libraries, that you can probably load from their o

by d--b 11y ago

Strange that this is coming from telerik, a company that creates really heavy and closed javascript framework libraries, that you can probably load from their own domain. They definitely have their part of responsibility in that 'cruft'...

paulojreis 11y ago
I had about the same feeling. Telerik components come to mind when thinking about extra/unnecessary complexity.
ommunist 11y ago
Oh, telerik also has wonderful system of web components for IIS, and its CMS powers Iranian governmental sites. Which given Iranian networks are not exactly the fastest, gives very interesting experiences for those inside the max2MBit world.
jeswin 11y ago
We can (must) judge this article on its own merit. While not particularly informative, it is well written and explains the problem very, very clearly. The examples and analysis make sense even to people who aren't developers. It helps to raise awareness about an important issue, and is a part of the solution. Telerik's cruft is somewhat different from the cruft referred to in the article. They offer "rich" UIs, which we might hate, but is just what many companies choose when they try to replace their old Windows Forms apps with web apps. With modern browsers, they aren't really that computationally expensive. And in any case, they aren't responsible for the type of issues mentioned in TFA. Like loading from dozens of domains, interstitial ads, social media links, and 200+ requests. Telerik's products cannot be evaluated in isolation without looking at their history. They primarily cater to enterprise-y Microsoft shops, and they been in the business at least from the classic Asp.Net days (10+ years). Their components were DLLs earlier (which they probably still offer), but have now moved to somewhat leaner, modern JavaScript libraries. Their market moves very slowly, and it makes sense for them to move at a similar pace.
- ommunist 11y ago
  You are right. However, the problem has no resolution in technical sense. When your boss tell you 'integrate that sh#t to this page now' you are just doing your job, right? You are not going to spend 4 nights developing technical proposal and organisational framework tailored to your employers business to introduce http2 and hire 3 interns to map external dependencies for the whole 50+ domains ecosystem, right? I did that several times in my life. Will not do that again.
yasth 11y ago
Telerik has been following Microsoft and going down the road to lighter, and more modern designs. They still have a ways to go mind, but they have been gradually at least talking the talk. (Though I think most of their revenue remains in integrated stuff).

by d--b 11y ago

paulojreis 11y ago

I had about the same feeling. Telerik components come to mind when thinking about extra/unnecessary complexity.

ommunist 11y ago

Oh, telerik also has wonderful system of web components for IIS, and its CMS powers Iranian governmental sites. Which given Iranian networks are not exactly the fastest, gives very interesting experiences for those inside the max2MBit world.

jeswin 11y ago

We can (must) judge this article on its own merit. While not particularly informative, it is well written and explains the problem very, very clearly. The examples and analysis make sense even to people who aren't developers. It helps to raise awareness about an important issue, and is a part of the solution. Telerik's cruft is somewhat different from the cruft referred to in the article. They offer "rich" UIs, which we might hate, but is just what many companies choose when they try to replace their old Windows Forms apps with web apps. With modern browsers, they aren't really that computationally expensive. And in any case, they aren't responsible for the type of issues mentioned in TFA. Like loading from dozens of domains, interstitial ads, social media links, and 200+ requests. Telerik's products cannot be evaluated in isolation without looking at their history. They primarily cater to enterprise-y Microsoft shops, and they been in the business at least from the classic Asp.Net days (10+ years). Their components were DLLs earlier (which they probably still offer), but have now moved to somewhat leaner, modern JavaScript libraries. Their market moves very slowly, and it makes sense for them to move at a similar pace.

ommunist 11y ago
You are right. However, the problem has no resolution in technical sense. When your boss tell you 'integrate that sh#t to this page now' you are just doing your job, right? You are not going to spend 4 nights developing technical proposal and organisational framework tailored to your employers business to introduce http2 and hire 3 interns to map external dependencies for the whole 50+ domains ecosystem, right? I did that several times in my life. Will not do that again.

yasth 11y ago

Telerik has been following Microsoft and going down the road to lighter, and more modern designs. They still have a ways to go mind, but they have been gradually at least talking the talk. (Though I think most of their revenue remains in integrated stuff).