4 ms·

Reminds me a bit of the Second Avenue Subway in Manhattan. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Avenue_Subway https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Avenue_Subway

by anonu 11y ago

Reminds me a bit of the Second Avenue Subway in Manhattan. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Avenue_Subway https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Avenue_Subway At least this one they're about to complete after 80+ years of on/off work...

melling 11y ago
They're only about to complete Phase I, the first two miles of the planned 8.5 miles. The entire tunnel will take a few more decades. For comparison, Shanghai started from zero and built the largest subway in the world in 20 years. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Subway#Timeline https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Subway#Timeline
- smackfu 11y ago
  It's often easier to start from zero.
  - melling 11y ago
    Can you explain why in this case? I don't really see how it can make that much of a difference. Shanghai was already a huge city, for example.
    - smackfu 11y ago
      New subway lines have to connect into existing running subway lines. Digging the tunnels is usually the easy part, it's the points where they connect to things that is hard.
      - melling 11y ago
        And that's why you think the 2nd Avenue Line will take 2-3 more decades? After 20 years the Shanghai subway is now bigger than NYC yet they are scheduled to add a couple hundred additional miles.
        smackfu 11y ago
        No, I was not answering that question. I think Shanghai gets stuff done faster because it's in China. And because they actually have funding.
        melling 11y ago
        And it's not relevant to the NYC subway either so the comment that you made was irrelevant. I'm not sure why you wasted everyone's time.
    - ChrisLTD 11y ago
      Building new tunnels in NYC takes a lot of careful work to avoid damaging the other underground infrastructure and above-ground buildings.
      - melling 11y ago
        Absolutely everyone knows that.
      - astrodust 11y ago
        You're implying Shanghai is an empty city with nothing below ground. It's probably got just as much subterranean junk as New York does.
  - ddeck 11y ago
    It's also likely easier to move faster when the public is more forgiving of worker deaths. No idea on cumulative statistics, but the following headlines are illustrative: SHANGHAI: Two men were killed and six others were injured here yesterday in two separate incidents at subway construction sites. [1] 5 dead and 18 injured in Shanghai Metro Line 12 construction site accident [2] Not Shanghai, but... On Nov 15, a subway tunnel under construction collapsed in Hangzhou, Zhejiang province, killing 17 people. [1] [1] http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-01/09/content_7380405.htm http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-01/09/content_738040... [2] http://www.exploremetro.com/blog/5-dead-and-18-injured-in-shanghai-metro-line-12-construction-site-accident http://www.exploremetro.com/blog/5-dead-and-18-injured-in-sh...
nemo44x 11y ago
There's no guarantee they are going to finish that project either! I certainly hope they do as that are of Manhattan desperately needs another line. The time and costs though - it makes you wonder how we used to be able to build things and now we can't so easily.
WildUtah 11y ago
"When they finish the Second Avenue Subway, this apartment will quadruple in value." [0] Mad Men had real estate agents promising the subway in 1965. Of course, the US$28k apartment in question is now worth about US$1MM, so it's true that the value will quadruple -- times at least ten. [0]http://videos.nymag.com/video/Mad-Men-Takes-on-the-2nd-Avenue;New-York-City#c=Q87NFZ08LZMMV3M1&t='Mad http://videos.nymag.com/video/Mad-Men-Takes-on-the-2nd-Avenu... Men' Takes on the 2nd Avenue Subway

by anonu 11y ago

melling 11y ago

They're only about to complete Phase I, the first two miles of the planned 8.5 miles. The entire tunnel will take a few more decades. For comparison, Shanghai started from zero and built the largest subway in the world in 20 years. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Subway#Timeline https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Subway#Timeline

smackfu 11y ago
It's often easier to start from zero.
- melling 11y ago
  Can you explain why in this case? I don't really see how it can make that much of a difference. Shanghai was already a huge city, for example.
  - smackfu 11y ago
    New subway lines have to connect into existing running subway lines. Digging the tunnels is usually the easy part, it's the points where they connect to things that is hard.
    - melling 11y ago
      And that's why you think the 2nd Avenue Line will take 2-3 more decades? After 20 years the Shanghai subway is now bigger than NYC yet they are scheduled to add a couple hundred additional miles.
      - smackfu 11y ago
        No, I was not answering that question. I think Shanghai gets stuff done faster because it's in China. And because they actually have funding.
        melling 11y ago
        And it's not relevant to the NYC subway either so the comment that you made was irrelevant. I'm not sure why you wasted everyone's time.
  - ChrisLTD 11y ago
    Building new tunnels in NYC takes a lot of careful work to avoid damaging the other underground infrastructure and above-ground buildings.
    - melling 11y ago
      Absolutely everyone knows that.
    - astrodust 11y ago
      You're implying Shanghai is an empty city with nothing below ground. It's probably got just as much subterranean junk as New York does.
- ddeck 11y ago
  It's also likely easier to move faster when the public is more forgiving of worker deaths. No idea on cumulative statistics, but the following headlines are illustrative: SHANGHAI: Two men were killed and six others were injured here yesterday in two separate incidents at subway construction sites. [1] 5 dead and 18 injured in Shanghai Metro Line 12 construction site accident [2] Not Shanghai, but... On Nov 15, a subway tunnel under construction collapsed in Hangzhou, Zhejiang province, killing 17 people. [1] [1] http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-01/09/content_7380405.htm http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-01/09/content_738040... [2] http://www.exploremetro.com/blog/5-dead-and-18-injured-in-shanghai-metro-line-12-construction-site-accident http://www.exploremetro.com/blog/5-dead-and-18-injured-in-sh...

nemo44x 11y ago

There's no guarantee they are going to finish that project either! I certainly hope they do as that are of Manhattan desperately needs another line. The time and costs though - it makes you wonder how we used to be able to build things and now we can't so easily.

WildUtah 11y ago

"When they finish the Second Avenue Subway, this apartment will quadruple in value." [0] Mad Men had real estate agents promising the subway in 1965. Of course, the US$28k apartment in question is now worth about US$1MM, so it's true that the value will quadruple -- times at least ten. [0]http://videos.nymag.com/video/Mad-Men-Takes-on-the-2nd-Avenue;New-York-City#c=Q87NFZ08LZMMV3M1&t='Mad http://videos.nymag.com/video/Mad-Men-Takes-on-the-2nd-Avenu... Men' Takes on the 2nd Avenue Subway