3 ms·

He should have spent time talking about the severance. Honestly, if I was going through a layoff, that's all I'd care about at that point.

seiji 11y ago
spent time talking about the severance. Often severance can be negotiated on an individual basis. Typically you start with some base amount (4 weeks + 2 weeks for every year at the company), but that can vary for different roles. e.g. when a CEO is fired, they typically get larger severance packages than bottom-of-the-org-chart employees (because, try putting out a job request: "Will be CEO for food." World doesn't work that way.) Also, severance payments+benefits aren't some magic gift from a company—it's a legal contract giving you monetary compensation in return for things like not disparaging the company in the future. Any time a company tries to bind your future actions outside of employment, you have room for negotiation.
- mrbill 11y ago
  I got hit in the layoffs at Halliburton here in Houston back in January, and at no time was "don't disparage the company" ever made a condition of accepting severance. In fact, the only thing I had to sign said "I've returned all of the company property I might have", and that was it.
  - seiji 11y ago
    Good point. At large companies, sometimes they don't include it for non-executives. At smaller companies, it should probably fall on everybody since each voice carries more weight and everybody would have more insight into the actual workings of the company. It's all about making a legal guard against employees trying to "retaliate" over being suddenly released from employment against their will. At large employers, edge nodes in the employment graph can't do much harm to the overall company because they probably don't have insight into the deeper machinations of what's really happening outside of their compartmentalized roles (employer->employee power dynamics are fun).
- irishcoffee 11y ago
  I just have to say, 4 weeks + 2 weeks per year at the company would be amazing. I get one week per year. If I worked 11 years, I get 11 weeks. Under your plan, I'd get 26, aka half a year. I think I need to find a new job.
- MatthewMcDonald 11y ago
  How do you negotiate your severance? I don't see the personbeing terminated as having much leverage. Are companies really that afraid that you'll bad mouth them? I'm struggling to imagine that conversation: "Here is 8 weeks compensation, in return for signing this non-disparagement agreement" "No, I want 12 weeks compensation or I won't sign your agreement"
  - seiji 11y ago
    Yup, basically right. It is still a legal document too. Typically severance documents will have a deadline to be signed which is after your official termination date. You're fully entitled to not sign anything at your termination so you can consult with counsel. If the stakes are high enough, a proper employment lawyer can advise you on proper next steps given your severance documents (what you're entitled to for their asks (non-competes? confidentiality? agreeing to company-run arbitration in any future matters?, etc). But, once you counter, they have the option to re-consider their entire offer, including perhaps withdrawing it completely if they consider the transaction no longer worth it. Then you're still dismissed and get nothing. All of this is assuming policies under american at-will employment. Any other contracts or government regulations can alter matters. Some countries even have mandatory severance of a year or more when fired, but those countries tend to not have great economic growth prospects (that's where Mitt Romney once said "I like being able to fire people" with the implication of otherwise dead weight just sits around knowing it can do nothing and still get paid).

seiji 11y ago

spent time talking about the severance. Often severance can be negotiated on an individual basis. Typically you start with some base amount (4 weeks + 2 weeks for every year at the company), but that can vary for different roles. e.g. when a CEO is fired, they typically get larger severance packages than bottom-of-the-org-chart employees (because, try putting out a job request: "Will be CEO for food." World doesn't work that way.) Also, severance payments+benefits aren't some magic gift from a company—it's a legal contract giving you monetary compensation in return for things like not disparaging the company in the future. Any time a company tries to bind your future actions outside of employment, you have room for negotiation.

mrbill 11y ago
I got hit in the layoffs at Halliburton here in Houston back in January, and at no time was "don't disparage the company" ever made a condition of accepting severance. In fact, the only thing I had to sign said "I've returned all of the company property I might have", and that was it.
- seiji 11y ago
  Good point. At large companies, sometimes they don't include it for non-executives. At smaller companies, it should probably fall on everybody since each voice carries more weight and everybody would have more insight into the actual workings of the company. It's all about making a legal guard against employees trying to "retaliate" over being suddenly released from employment against their will. At large employers, edge nodes in the employment graph can't do much harm to the overall company because they probably don't have insight into the deeper machinations of what's really happening outside of their compartmentalized roles (employer->employee power dynamics are fun).
irishcoffee 11y ago
I just have to say, 4 weeks + 2 weeks per year at the company would be amazing. I get one week per year. If I worked 11 years, I get 11 weeks. Under your plan, I'd get 26, aka half a year. I think I need to find a new job.
MatthewMcDonald 11y ago
How do you negotiate your severance? I don't see the personbeing terminated as having much leverage. Are companies really that afraid that you'll bad mouth them? I'm struggling to imagine that conversation: "Here is 8 weeks compensation, in return for signing this non-disparagement agreement" "No, I want 12 weeks compensation or I won't sign your agreement"
- seiji 11y ago
  Yup, basically right. It is still a legal document too. Typically severance documents will have a deadline to be signed which is after your official termination date. You're fully entitled to not sign anything at your termination so you can consult with counsel. If the stakes are high enough, a proper employment lawyer can advise you on proper next steps given your severance documents (what you're entitled to for their asks (non-competes? confidentiality? agreeing to company-run arbitration in any future matters?, etc). But, once you counter, they have the option to re-consider their entire offer, including perhaps withdrawing it completely if they consider the transaction no longer worth it. Then you're still dismissed and get nothing. All of this is assuming policies under american at-will employment. Any other contracts or government regulations can alter matters. Some countries even have mandatory severance of a year or more when fired, but those countries tend to not have great economic growth prospects (that's where Mitt Romney once said "I like being able to fire people" with the implication of otherwise dead weight just sits around knowing it can do nothing and still get paid).