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> What are these politcal benefits? Security benefits, seams like the EU is more likly to cause war then to make it go away. From what I understand, the primar

> What are these politcal benefits? Security benefits, seams like the EU is more likly to cause war then to make it go away. From what I understand, the primary purpose of the EU is politics and security. It was created by the survivors of WWI and WWII. They needed a way to prevent another European war, and the solution was to bind together into "ever closer union". It worked amazingly well -- one of the most successful acts of international relations I can think of -- war between EU states, who had been fighting each other for hundreds of years and had devastated the continent twice in the first half of the century, is now unthinkable. We were born with it and assume it, but from the perspective of 1945 and centuries before that, it's a miracle. Another way to think of it: Why not have a democratic mechanism to decide common issues? Democracy is what we believe in, and the alternative is the anarchy of the strong abusing the weak.

nickik 11y ago
> It worked amazingly well -- one of the most successful acts of international relations I can think of Correlation is not Causation Your theory need some evidence. Their are a number of other factors to be considered. I can list a few if you like, change in culture, change in structure of government, military commitment to protect status quo by the dominat power (this is unliky after WW1), cold war thread and a number of other things. The EU was only founded in 1993 so you need something else to explain 1945 to 1993. The reality is that the desaster that the EU and the Eurozone have brought onto Europe has made war more likly then it has been since the last balkan war. Its the biggest economic desaster since the great depression. It has weakend the communality feeling between European Nations more then any alternative system of alliance ever could have. Its a absolut failure in every single way, by ever possible metric. > war between EU states, who had been fighting each other for hundreds of years and had devastated the continent twice in the first half of the century War was unthinkable before 1914 by many people as well. Freedom since 1870 and that was not a huge war. The only war that had three powers in it, was in 1853. People back then did absolutly not belive that a war would happen. In the Interwar years most people were absolutly certain that no war was gone happen as well. People in Britain and France could not belive that anybody was mad enougth that they would actually want to repeat the idiocy that was WW1. Sadly because of many factors a small number of people who did want to repeat the experiance came to power. This is why the Brits were so strong on Appeasement. > Why not have a democratic mechanism to decide common issues? Why is the EU so absolutly undemocratic in every way then? Why can democratic nation not make bilateral agreements to integrate economically. Why not have a bottum up democratic process, why do we have to have this horrible burocratic wanna be state? Again, EU has been a desaster in every way, the 'their was no war excuse' is absolutly weak.

nickik 11y ago

> It worked amazingly well -- one of the most successful acts of international relations I can think of Correlation is not Causation Your theory need some evidence. Their are a number of other factors to be considered. I can list a few if you like, change in culture, change in structure of government, military commitment to protect status quo by the dominat power (this is unliky after WW1), cold war thread and a number of other things. The EU was only founded in 1993 so you need something else to explain 1945 to 1993. The reality is that the desaster that the EU and the Eurozone have brought onto Europe has made war more likly then it has been since the last balkan war. Its the biggest economic desaster since the great depression. It has weakend the communality feeling between European Nations more then any alternative system of alliance ever could have. Its a absolut failure in every single way, by ever possible metric. > war between EU states, who had been fighting each other for hundreds of years and had devastated the continent twice in the first half of the century War was unthinkable before 1914 by many people as well. Freedom since 1870 and that was not a huge war. The only war that had three powers in it, was in 1853. People back then did absolutly not belive that a war would happen. In the Interwar years most people were absolutly certain that no war was gone happen as well. People in Britain and France could not belive that anybody was mad enougth that they would actually want to repeat the idiocy that was WW1. Sadly because of many factors a small number of people who did want to repeat the experiance came to power. This is why the Brits were so strong on Appeasement. > Why not have a democratic mechanism to decide common issues? Why is the EU so absolutly undemocratic in every way then? Why can democratic nation not make bilateral agreements to integrate economically. Why not have a bottum up democratic process, why do we have to have this horrible burocratic wanna be state? Again, EU has been a desaster in every way, the 'their was no war excuse' is absolutly weak.