3 ms·

This seems to also be the case with DO, I setup a mail server on an instance there and can't escape people's spam boxes.

arrty88 11y ago
FWIW, I am able to send mail effectively from my Linode box, (passing SPF and DKIM).
- kijin 11y ago
  Linode has always been very strict about keeping their IP ranges clean. The fact that Linode's lowest tier has been $20/mo until recently ($10/mom nowadays) also helps. That makes Linode unnecessarily expensive for people who just want to burn IPs, since they can easily get an IP for $5/mo with DO or even less with low-end VPS providers.
brobinson 11y ago
Check the IP against the spam blacklists: http://mxtoolbox.com/blacklists.aspx http://mxtoolbox.com/blacklists.aspx You might have to spin up a bunch of servers to find one which doesn't have a blacklisted IP. Then you have to build the IP's "reputation" with the various providers before you can send a significant amount of email through it.
- quadrature 11y ago
  Thanks, I just assumed their whole block would be blacklisted. I'll try some more.
  - ceejayoz 11y ago
    Not blacklisted, just treated with higher suspicion by default.
- massaman_yams 11y ago
  These days, there are only a handful of IP-based blacklists where a listing result in more than low single-digit impact to your delivery rate; moreover, among industry insiders, Gmail isn't known to use any public IP-based blacklist for deliverability.
  - brobinson 11y ago
    >Gmail isn't known to use any public IP-based blacklist for deliverability Good to know! I bet they have their own internal ranking system which is far more accurate than the public blacklists.
    - stonogo 11y ago
      I'm curious to know why you think they'd be any more accurate than public blacklists. About a fifth of the spam that hits my domains originates from gmail servers, and the majority of people I know complain (when asked) about gmail's tendency to spam-bin legit mail.
      - brobinson 11y ago
        I would wager that Google handles a large enough cross section of all email traffic such that their internal statistics on the trustworthiness of domains/ips would rival any other blacklist system. I've never had issues inboxing on gmail accounts using SPF/DKIM/DMARC + Sendgrid, even when sending 125,000+ emails (legit!) per day.
        massaman_yams 11y ago
        Accuracy in spam filters is a difficult thing to measure, particularly if you don't have access to internal metrics on filter performance. The primary limiting factor for most blacklists is not scale, but simply the fact that most of them have no more than a few data sources - most commonly spamtrap data. It's useful, but it's not a comprehensive enough data point to accurately evaluate mail. Having dozens or hundreds of data points available - things like how many recipients open a message and spend time reading it, how quickly they seek out a message when initially opening their inbox, or a sending domain's pagerank - gives Google a considerable edge in assessing overall mail quality. (Caveat: outbound filtering is often more difficult than inbound filtering - perhaps in part because there are fewer data points available when assessing outbound mail.)
mattkrea 11y ago
I ran my personal mail server on DO for about a year or so without issue. I would definitely try a new instance--I didn't even know this was a problem.

arrty88 11y ago

FWIW, I am able to send mail effectively from my Linode box, (passing SPF and DKIM).

kijin 11y ago
Linode has always been very strict about keeping their IP ranges clean. The fact that Linode's lowest tier has been $20/mo until recently ($10/mom nowadays) also helps. That makes Linode unnecessarily expensive for people who just want to burn IPs, since they can easily get an IP for $5/mo with DO or even less with low-end VPS providers.

brobinson 11y ago

Check the IP against the spam blacklists: http://mxtoolbox.com/blacklists.aspx http://mxtoolbox.com/blacklists.aspx You might have to spin up a bunch of servers to find one which doesn't have a blacklisted IP. Then you have to build the IP's "reputation" with the various providers before you can send a significant amount of email through it.

quadrature 11y ago
Thanks, I just assumed their whole block would be blacklisted. I'll try some more.
- ceejayoz 11y ago
  Not blacklisted, just treated with higher suspicion by default.
massaman_yams 11y ago
These days, there are only a handful of IP-based blacklists where a listing result in more than low single-digit impact to your delivery rate; moreover, among industry insiders, Gmail isn't known to use any public IP-based blacklist for deliverability.
- brobinson 11y ago
  >Gmail isn't known to use any public IP-based blacklist for deliverability Good to know! I bet they have their own internal ranking system which is far more accurate than the public blacklists.
  - stonogo 11y ago
    I'm curious to know why you think they'd be any more accurate than public blacklists. About a fifth of the spam that hits my domains originates from gmail servers, and the majority of people I know complain (when asked) about gmail's tendency to spam-bin legit mail.
    - brobinson 11y ago
      I would wager that Google handles a large enough cross section of all email traffic such that their internal statistics on the trustworthiness of domains/ips would rival any other blacklist system. I've never had issues inboxing on gmail accounts using SPF/DKIM/DMARC + Sendgrid, even when sending 125,000+ emails (legit!) per day.
      - massaman_yams 11y ago
        Accuracy in spam filters is a difficult thing to measure, particularly if you don't have access to internal metrics on filter performance. The primary limiting factor for most blacklists is not scale, but simply the fact that most of them have no more than a few data sources - most commonly spamtrap data. It's useful, but it's not a comprehensive enough data point to accurately evaluate mail. Having dozens or hundreds of data points available - things like how many recipients open a message and spend time reading it, how quickly they seek out a message when initially opening their inbox, or a sending domain's pagerank - gives Google a considerable edge in assessing overall mail quality. (Caveat: outbound filtering is often more difficult than inbound filtering - perhaps in part because there are fewer data points available when assessing outbound mail.)

mattkrea 11y ago

I ran my personal mail server on DO for about a year or so without issue. I would definitely try a new instance--I didn't even know this was a problem.