4 ms·

How many tens of millions of dollars has Microsoft sunk in Surface, tablets and other touch technologies, only to have Apple eat their lunch? How many billions

How many tens of millions of dollars has Microsoft sunk in Surface, tablets and other touch technologies, only to have Apple eat their lunch? How many billions sunk in MSR every year yielding no commercial products? Microsoft has always needed to get their product vision from somewhere else, and for all of the hoopla about Nadella and open sourcing everything, that core fact about Microsoft hasn't changed. It's really sad because Microsoft has everything stacked in its favour to succeed. I mean it's not like like don't succeed on those products that they copy from others, starting from Windows all the way down to the Xbox and Bing, but when it comes to commercial innovation, that's not who they are.

ethanbond 11y ago
Microsoft seems to be perfectly successful to me, no? R&D, by virtue of being R&D, rarely makes it to the market in a recognizable form. My guess is that the lessons learned there certainly have been applied to their real profit centers.
- Someone1234 11y ago
  Plus their massive patent portfolio has definitely paid off in various ways. PS - I don't personally like software patents, but you cannot deny they make money for research-based organisations.
  - frandroid 11y ago
    The patent portfolio is a good point, I'll concede that.
- frandroid 11y ago
  > it's not like like don't succeed on those products I acknowledged that they are successful. But they aren't successful in creating new markets; they succeed in invading existing ones.
melling 11y ago
I'm a bit of an Apple fan, but let's be honest, Apple isn't eating Microsoft's lunch. Apple has 18% mobile market share, and it seems that they've broken into the double-digits in desktop share: http://techcrunch.com/2014/11/07/mac-achieves-highest-u-s-pc-market-share-ever-in-q3-2014-according-to-idc/ http://techcrunch.com/2014/11/07/mac-achieves-highest-u-s-pc...
- frandroid 11y ago
  I'm talking about how Apple obliterated Microsoft in the tablet and smartphone markets, which Microsoft had several years of headway in.
  - melling 11y ago
    Yes, they obliterated them by about 15%!!! Boom!!! http://www.idc.com/prodserv/smartphone-os-market-share.jsp http://www.idc.com/prodserv/smartphone-os-market-share.jsp Did Android obliterate Apple? That margin is about 60%. Yes, Microsoft screwed up, but they can always turn it around and grab a quick 10% share. They've got tons of money and talent. I'd never count them out. In fact, they're still pretty dangerous.
    - bad_user 11y ago
      Well, problem is there is no room for a third place IMHO. This happens in general when a dominant design wins and I think we are witnessing one. Of course they can fake it with their new windows sales, but that opportunity is lost.
    - frandroid 11y ago
      Apple makes more profit than the 82% of the market that they don't control. That's a kind of obliteration. "could", you mean "can't." They've been trying to grab 10% market share since the iPhone pushed them below that, and have never recovered, in spite of having the best resources of anyone out there.
ZenoArrow 11y ago
Microsoft Research is very strong, it's just that their work is broader than just new gadgets, though if you're interested in that then Kinect is an example of a product refined at MSR, plus you have the upcoming HoloLens. For a broader understanding of what MSR does, check out their work on quantum computing ( http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/research-areas/quantum-computing.aspx http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/research-areas/quantum-c... ) and functional programming (Microsoft Research Cambridge and MSR-Inria are good places to look into for this). That's just the tip of the iceberg, Microsoft plows plenty of resources into R&D. The fact they invest in fundamental research isn't something to attack, it's something to celebrate, not all research needs to result in a tangible product.

ethanbond 11y ago

Microsoft seems to be perfectly successful to me, no? R&D, by virtue of being R&D, rarely makes it to the market in a recognizable form. My guess is that the lessons learned there certainly have been applied to their real profit centers.

Someone1234 11y ago
Plus their massive patent portfolio has definitely paid off in various ways. PS - I don't personally like software patents, but you cannot deny they make money for research-based organisations.
- frandroid 11y ago
  The patent portfolio is a good point, I'll concede that.
frandroid 11y ago
> it's not like like don't succeed on those products I acknowledged that they are successful. But they aren't successful in creating new markets; they succeed in invading existing ones.

melling 11y ago

I'm a bit of an Apple fan, but let's be honest, Apple isn't eating Microsoft's lunch. Apple has 18% mobile market share, and it seems that they've broken into the double-digits in desktop share: http://techcrunch.com/2014/11/07/mac-achieves-highest-u-s-pc-market-share-ever-in-q3-2014-according-to-idc/ http://techcrunch.com/2014/11/07/mac-achieves-highest-u-s-pc...

frandroid 11y ago
I'm talking about how Apple obliterated Microsoft in the tablet and smartphone markets, which Microsoft had several years of headway in.
- melling 11y ago
  Yes, they obliterated them by about 15%!!! Boom!!! http://www.idc.com/prodserv/smartphone-os-market-share.jsp http://www.idc.com/prodserv/smartphone-os-market-share.jsp Did Android obliterate Apple? That margin is about 60%. Yes, Microsoft screwed up, but they can always turn it around and grab a quick 10% share. They've got tons of money and talent. I'd never count them out. In fact, they're still pretty dangerous.
  - bad_user 11y ago
    Well, problem is there is no room for a third place IMHO. This happens in general when a dominant design wins and I think we are witnessing one. Of course they can fake it with their new windows sales, but that opportunity is lost.
  - frandroid 11y ago
    Apple makes more profit than the 82% of the market that they don't control. That's a kind of obliteration. "could", you mean "can't." They've been trying to grab 10% market share since the iPhone pushed them below that, and have never recovered, in spite of having the best resources of anyone out there.

ZenoArrow 11y ago

Microsoft Research is very strong, it's just that their work is broader than just new gadgets, though if you're interested in that then Kinect is an example of a product refined at MSR, plus you have the upcoming HoloLens. For a broader understanding of what MSR does, check out their work on quantum computing ( http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/research-areas/quantum-computing.aspx http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/research-areas/quantum-c... ) and functional programming (Microsoft Research Cambridge and MSR-Inria are good places to look into for this). That's just the tip of the iceberg, Microsoft plows plenty of resources into R&D. The fact they invest in fundamental research isn't something to attack, it's something to celebrate, not all research needs to result in a tangible product.