4 ms·

> saying things to someone which that person doesn't want to hear. You know you can put fingers in your ears, right?

pjc50 11y ago
This is the "if you didn't want to get abuse from white people you should have sat at the back of the bus" / "you should have known that being a prominent woman on twitter would get you daily rape threats" argument. As others are saying, it's not costless, in fact its quite damaging to the psyche. Because you can't know, until communication starts, whether it's going to be vicious. And you can't walk around with your fingers in your ears all the time. Some internet services get this, but it's awfully easy for people to generate new accounts to route abuse through. We could do well to develop anti-abuse technology in the same mode as anti-spam.
- venomsnake 11y ago
  > And you can't walk around with your fingers in your ears all the time. I can only assume you have not talked with antivaxxers, climate change deniers or people taking their religion too seriously. Whether insult hurts or not is your choice. If you have such weak control over your inner world - learn to not give a fuck. not that hard.
  - elemenopy 11y ago
    > Whether insult hurts or not is your choice. This is nonsense. If you are subjected to continuous, vitriolic, realistic rape threats on Twitter then this is inevitably going to stress you and make you feel somewhat unhappy or unsafe. But if you are a 14-year-old, or otherwise particularly vulnerable, then they may cause acute depression or suicide. This Act isn't about antivaxxers or climate change deniers. It is about revenge porn and vicious cyberbullying, and I am not prepared to stand up for either.
    - jbob2000 11y ago
      If you receive that many threats on twitter, then leave twitter. It's not like you walk out of your residence every morning and every car passing by is yelling rape threats at you. It's not like you're getting on the bus and being yelled at. It's not like you're going to work and having your coworkers threaten you. Some assholes sent you digital messages on a website. That's it. Leave the website if it is such a problem.
  - onion2k 11y ago
    Whether insult hurts or not is your choice. If you have such weak control over your inner world - learn to not give a fuck. not that hard. The problem here is that most people who suggest 'just ignore it' as a solution haven't ever faced the sort of abuse that the proposed law is designed to deal with. You're quite right that it's easy to ignore an insult. It's much harder to ignore a believable death or rape threat, racist remark, misogyny, etc. That is what you're suggesting people should 'learn to not give a fuck' about. As someone who believes quite strongly that we shouldn't just ignore those things and that we should actively try to stop them, I find your argument incomprehensible.
    - venomsnake 11y ago
      While ignoring a believable (whatever that means) death treat is probably hard, why put racism, misandry and misogeny in the same stuff - you are totally free to talk to the harassers back - find what makes them sensitive and make them hurt. You have the same tools as them. Make a psychological profile, find what makes them tick and talk back in a way to inflict maximum hurt feelz.

pjc50 11y ago

This is the "if you didn't want to get abuse from white people you should have sat at the back of the bus" / "you should have known that being a prominent woman on twitter would get you daily rape threats" argument. As others are saying, it's not costless, in fact its quite damaging to the psyche. Because you can't know, until communication starts, whether it's going to be vicious. And you can't walk around with your fingers in your ears all the time. Some internet services get this, but it's awfully easy for people to generate new accounts to route abuse through. We could do well to develop anti-abuse technology in the same mode as anti-spam.

venomsnake 11y ago
> And you can't walk around with your fingers in your ears all the time. I can only assume you have not talked with antivaxxers, climate change deniers or people taking their religion too seriously. Whether insult hurts or not is your choice. If you have such weak control over your inner world - learn to not give a fuck. not that hard.
- elemenopy 11y ago
  > Whether insult hurts or not is your choice. This is nonsense. If you are subjected to continuous, vitriolic, realistic rape threats on Twitter then this is inevitably going to stress you and make you feel somewhat unhappy or unsafe. But if you are a 14-year-old, or otherwise particularly vulnerable, then they may cause acute depression or suicide. This Act isn't about antivaxxers or climate change deniers. It is about revenge porn and vicious cyberbullying, and I am not prepared to stand up for either.
  - jbob2000 11y ago
    If you receive that many threats on twitter, then leave twitter. It's not like you walk out of your residence every morning and every car passing by is yelling rape threats at you. It's not like you're getting on the bus and being yelled at. It's not like you're going to work and having your coworkers threaten you. Some assholes sent you digital messages on a website. That's it. Leave the website if it is such a problem.
- onion2k 11y ago
  Whether insult hurts or not is your choice. If you have such weak control over your inner world - learn to not give a fuck. not that hard. The problem here is that most people who suggest 'just ignore it' as a solution haven't ever faced the sort of abuse that the proposed law is designed to deal with. You're quite right that it's easy to ignore an insult. It's much harder to ignore a believable death or rape threat, racist remark, misogyny, etc. That is what you're suggesting people should 'learn to not give a fuck' about. As someone who believes quite strongly that we shouldn't just ignore those things and that we should actively try to stop them, I find your argument incomprehensible.
  - venomsnake 11y ago
    While ignoring a believable (whatever that means) death treat is probably hard, why put racism, misandry and misogeny in the same stuff - you are totally free to talk to the harassers back - find what makes them sensitive and make them hurt. You have the same tools as them. Make a psychological profile, find what makes them tick and talk back in a way to inflict maximum hurt feelz.