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The best shape ever? Like before western civilization came when it was the grand prairie? Also, there are issues with runoff: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/1

The best shape ever? Like before western civilization came when it was the grand prairie? Also, there are issues with runoff: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/19/us/conflict-over-soil-and-water-quality-puts-iowa-nice-to-a-test.html http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/19/us/conflict-over-soil-and-... There's also a concern about water management. Natural ecosystems tend to get the most out of their water usage. I seem to recall that the midwest water aquifers are a limited resource. That aside, I can buy that soil is improving. I also agree that we can make it work. I do applaud regenerative efforts in Iowa. However, I'm looking at a global scale, where desertification, pollution, runoff, lowering productivity, etc. are big problems. As an analogy, many climate change deniers will claim that it's still winter in their local area, but that perception is not fully representative of what is happening on a global scale. Re: the industrial paradigm on improving local soil systems; is importing nutrition on a massive scale, robbing that nutrition from other ecosystems, a responsible thing to do in a global context? I'm realistic in the sense that some importation may be necessary, in fact nature moves nutrients via animals, wind, etc. However, nature works in a cooperative & systemic way.

JoeAltmaier 11y ago
Our soil is about perfect for growing what we grow. Topsoil used to be the big thing, before ammonia fertilizer. Now the best crops grow on clay hillsides. Which we have plenty of, since Iowa used to be largely timber. Confused about the 'importing nutrients' thing - ammonia fertilizer is fixed from the air (since WWII); no more shipping bat guano around the country.
- briantakita 11y ago
  I can't criticize your approach, since I'm not a farmer. I respect what you do & the work that it takes to run a farm. I can only point out what I've seen & what inspires me. re: Amonia > A typical modern ammonia-producing plant first converts natural gas (i.e., methane) or LPG (liquefied petroleum gases such as propane and butane) or petroleum naphtha into gaseous hydrogen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonia_production https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonia_production This requires the importation or local extraction of fossil fuels. Given that the United States is now utilizing fracking to extract natural gas, this causes pollution within the aquifers as well as reducing the integrity of the surface strata. A natural approach of fertilization is animal poop from grazing & polycultures (nitrogen fixing perennial plants, like Black Locust), similar to how the ancient prairies were fertilized. Mark Shepard, who's farm is in Wisconsin, has a large scale example of "Restoration Agriculture". He has a silvopasture that feeds his livestock. The livestock fertilize the fields. He also grows nuts. He also saves money by not having to buy fertilizer or pesticides. He also uses keyline design, swales, & ponds to efficiently use water & reduce runoff. http://www.newforestfarm.net/ http://www.newforestfarm.net/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kb_t-sVVzF0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kb_t-sVVzF0 Here's a great talk by Gabe Brown from Idaho using natural, regenerative methods to rebuild soil. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yPjoh9YJMk&feature=youtu.be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yPjoh9YJMk&feature=youtu.be My friends at http://www.fieldswithoutfences.org/ http://www.fieldswithoutfences.org/ in New Jersey have a lush polyculture medicinal herb & food farm that started from rocky spent earth. There was no top soil when they started a few years ago. You can see how it looks right now. http://www.fieldswithoutfences.org/permaculture/ http://www.fieldswithoutfences.org/permaculture/
  - JoeAltmaier 11y ago
    Natural fertilizer is a pile of manure. There's no chance the supply will come close to serving the demand. Also, its already being used (you have to do something with it) and its only mildly useful. Unless you have some political point to make, its always supplemented (read: almost totally surpassed) by ammonia and other carefully calculated amendments. Vs whatever randomly came out of a cows back end.
    - briantakita 11y ago
      Natural fertilizer is how our ecosystems were made to be so productive. Your land in Iowa is incredibly productive from a legacy of natural fertilization. There are a growing number of examples of farmers using natural methods in the modern context. There is some supplementation, especially in the beginning to re-mediate lands that have been damaged by conventional agriculture; however nature has a way of making things work. Natural polyculture systems produce more food than monocultures for a number of reasons, such as utilizing multiple layers, creating a functioning ecological systems, more efficient water usage, etc. This is done despite the lack of research that goes into creating natural food systems. Imagine how much better it will be when it's fully adopted. Re demand: Much of our demand is artificial, narrow, globally structured, driven by subsidies, marketing, & supply. Corn based ethanol uses more energy than it creates. The only reason for corn based ethanol is to subsidize certain farmers. Our level of factory meat production is also destructive to the environment, resource intensive, & unhealthy. America pushes junk food creating an unhealthy, morbidly obese population. I'm just pointing out how ecological & biological systems work, the consequences of the status quo, & how things can be improved. I stand to be a good steward of our planet by considering the global systemic implications of our systems. That is the ethical thing to do. It's easy to hide behind rationalizations to shirk responsibility to explore viable options that have been proven to work. If you see that as political, then you also being political.
      - JoeAltmaier 11y ago
        This is an urban legend. Iowa is so incredibly productive because it get sun and rain in a good predictable quantity, and we apply man-made fertilizer to largely level fields in controlled quantities. The rest is wishful thinking. Topsoil became irrelevant to farming decades ago. Returning to a Pollyanna view of a perfect agrarian society of cows fertilizing humble fields of vegetables, would result in widespread shortages. Corn based ethanol no longer uses more energy than it creates; that threshold was reached years ago. Some more reading is in order, I suggest. Just pointing out how agriculture economic systems work, and its absolutely nothing like described above.

JoeAltmaier 11y ago

Our soil is about perfect for growing what we grow. Topsoil used to be the big thing, before ammonia fertilizer. Now the best crops grow on clay hillsides. Which we have plenty of, since Iowa used to be largely timber. Confused about the 'importing nutrients' thing - ammonia fertilizer is fixed from the air (since WWII); no more shipping bat guano around the country.

briantakita 11y ago
I can't criticize your approach, since I'm not a farmer. I respect what you do & the work that it takes to run a farm. I can only point out what I've seen & what inspires me. re: Amonia > A typical modern ammonia-producing plant first converts natural gas (i.e., methane) or LPG (liquefied petroleum gases such as propane and butane) or petroleum naphtha into gaseous hydrogen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonia_production https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammonia_production This requires the importation or local extraction of fossil fuels. Given that the United States is now utilizing fracking to extract natural gas, this causes pollution within the aquifers as well as reducing the integrity of the surface strata. A natural approach of fertilization is animal poop from grazing & polycultures (nitrogen fixing perennial plants, like Black Locust), similar to how the ancient prairies were fertilized. Mark Shepard, who's farm is in Wisconsin, has a large scale example of "Restoration Agriculture". He has a silvopasture that feeds his livestock. The livestock fertilize the fields. He also grows nuts. He also saves money by not having to buy fertilizer or pesticides. He also uses keyline design, swales, & ponds to efficiently use water & reduce runoff. http://www.newforestfarm.net/ http://www.newforestfarm.net/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kb_t-sVVzF0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kb_t-sVVzF0 Here's a great talk by Gabe Brown from Idaho using natural, regenerative methods to rebuild soil. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yPjoh9YJMk&feature=youtu.be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yPjoh9YJMk&feature=youtu.be My friends at http://www.fieldswithoutfences.org/ http://www.fieldswithoutfences.org/ in New Jersey have a lush polyculture medicinal herb & food farm that started from rocky spent earth. There was no top soil when they started a few years ago. You can see how it looks right now. http://www.fieldswithoutfences.org/permaculture/ http://www.fieldswithoutfences.org/permaculture/
- JoeAltmaier 11y ago
  Natural fertilizer is a pile of manure. There's no chance the supply will come close to serving the demand. Also, its already being used (you have to do something with it) and its only mildly useful. Unless you have some political point to make, its always supplemented (read: almost totally surpassed) by ammonia and other carefully calculated amendments. Vs whatever randomly came out of a cows back end.
  - briantakita 11y ago
    Natural fertilizer is how our ecosystems were made to be so productive. Your land in Iowa is incredibly productive from a legacy of natural fertilization. There are a growing number of examples of farmers using natural methods in the modern context. There is some supplementation, especially in the beginning to re-mediate lands that have been damaged by conventional agriculture; however nature has a way of making things work. Natural polyculture systems produce more food than monocultures for a number of reasons, such as utilizing multiple layers, creating a functioning ecological systems, more efficient water usage, etc. This is done despite the lack of research that goes into creating natural food systems. Imagine how much better it will be when it's fully adopted. Re demand: Much of our demand is artificial, narrow, globally structured, driven by subsidies, marketing, & supply. Corn based ethanol uses more energy than it creates. The only reason for corn based ethanol is to subsidize certain farmers. Our level of factory meat production is also destructive to the environment, resource intensive, & unhealthy. America pushes junk food creating an unhealthy, morbidly obese population. I'm just pointing out how ecological & biological systems work, the consequences of the status quo, & how things can be improved. I stand to be a good steward of our planet by considering the global systemic implications of our systems. That is the ethical thing to do. It's easy to hide behind rationalizations to shirk responsibility to explore viable options that have been proven to work. If you see that as political, then you also being political.
    - JoeAltmaier 11y ago
      This is an urban legend. Iowa is so incredibly productive because it get sun and rain in a good predictable quantity, and we apply man-made fertilizer to largely level fields in controlled quantities. The rest is wishful thinking. Topsoil became irrelevant to farming decades ago. Returning to a Pollyanna view of a perfect agrarian society of cows fertilizing humble fields of vegetables, would result in widespread shortages. Corn based ethanol no longer uses more energy than it creates; that threshold was reached years ago. Some more reading is in order, I suggest. Just pointing out how agriculture economic systems work, and its absolutely nothing like described above.