8 ms·

You know what? I propose we use "Task HN:" and do these requests more frequently. We'll surely learn a lot, come to ingenious solutions, and maybe, just maybe,

You know what? I propose we use "Task HN:" and do these requests more frequently. We'll surely learn a lot, come to ingenious solutions, and maybe, just maybe, make our time on HN more productive. I, for one, want to at least see, if not help, what small but interesting byte-size hurdles others encounter and how others can solve it in different ways, and all the discussion around it. Working on something together binds communities even tighter.

iwillinc 11y ago
This is such a good god damn idea.
logicrime 11y ago
Yeah, what harm could come of asking people interested in news aggregation to complete tasks they have little interest in and little reason to do so? Surely the overall quality of HN won't suffer even more from people asking other hackers to write their C for them, what a great idea! fucking /s
- theVirginian 11y ago
  If you don't like it then don't participate. Some of these projects might be interesting. Unlike you apparently I actually like programming and do have an interest in taking part.
- synthmeat 11y ago
  Uninteresting tasks won't get upvoted. Interesting tasks get upvoted, and become a story in itself. Surely it won't have as detrimental effect as anonymous throwaway accounts rich with shallow sarcasm and curse words.
  - logicrime 11y ago
    The truth hurts, but lies kill. The large majority of HN readers are lurkers, who don't vote at all, the next largest group are those who aren't able to downvote, followed by the smallest group, the downvote-capable. I've got a few accounts that have downvote and dozens without, but it's not enough to stop the constant barrage of stupidity that floods what is supposed to be a news aggregation list. I don't mind seeing SHOW HN:'s, I like seeing what hackers are working on. On the other hand, a bunch of posts TASK HN: Write a C wrapper because I can't do it, that's gonna get old real fuckin' quick. I will shill as hard as I can, but I fear that it won't be enough.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- happyscrappy 11y ago
  Seeing the same problem solved in different ways is one of the best ways to learn. Cynicism is intellectual junk food.
- tomjen3 11y ago
  I share your concern, but if the tasks are of little interests and there are no great reason to do them, surely they will not be upvoted? HN has always been a bit more than a news aggregator, there are "Tell HN"s and "Show HN"s too.
pmorici 11y ago
Sounds like that would devolve into a situation where people are trying to exploit others for free work. There are plenty of places on the Internet where you can go to find people asking others to write software for them for little or no money. Should this really be one of them?
- synthmeat 11y ago
  I believe the same trend like in any (most) other non-news submissions will follow - intellectually stimulating tasks get upvoted.
- philippnagel 11y ago
  Upvoting/downvoting should, at least in theory, prevent that from happening.
  - brudgers 11y ago
    The best form of moderation is not encouraging behavior that requires moderation. Downvotes are a form of community feedback but not really a moderation tool. For example, in cases where I am in doubt about the benefit of something to HN, my threshold for downvoting is much larger than my threshold for upvoting: I am more likely to upvote when "it might be useful" than to downvote a "might not be useful" because there is a person's karma at the other end of the arrow.
  - ed_blackburn 11y ago
    Absolutely. Apply judgement.
  - aw3c2 11y ago
    There is no downvoting at HN
- kryptiskt 11y ago
  If the result is open source I don't see that as a huge problem.
  - 11y ago
brudgers 11y ago
I agree with the sentiment. Leveraging the skill and goodwill of the community is a great idea and anything that reduces the friction for volunteers is a good idea. On The other hand, I think there is little to be gained from frictionless requests for volunteers. That invites spam and low quality requests because there's nothing to lose. A linked blog post with technical details and relevant context is probably the ideal level of impedence with the HN format. The format of this request is a nice hack, but standardizing on a kludge is not the way to go. Maybe the structure is a monthly "Can you help?" thread...and perhaps a complimentary "Can I help?" thread.
- synthmeat 11y ago
  > That invites spam and low quality requests because there's nothing to lose. I think you may be underestimating desire for geek cred. Non-throwaway account would have little incentive to just spam with trivial tasks because they won't be upvoted, might even be flagged, and are tarnishing individuals reputation. You may have a point about format not being ideal and having too little friction. Not sure. > Maybe the structure is a monthly "Can you help?" thread...and perhaps a complimentary "Can I help?" thread. This most certainly wouldn't work for these types of requests, as they are rarely in opportunity to be scheduled for the next month, or at the very least, get solved by then by ugly hacks. Again, not sure what would emerge out of it really.
  - brudgers 11y ago
    I've seen plenty of behavior outside community norms from non-throwaway accounts on HN. Including my own. If an open source project can't schedule major features a month out, then throwing more bodies at it won't solve the fundamental problem of disorganization and isn't prepared to make appropriate use of volunteer's time in ways that really value that time. Structuring policy around a continuous stream of "emergencies" invites low quality requests. A policy which parallels HN's job listing policy favors HN members rather than people for whom everything above zero euros is paying too much. The HN community benefits from a slower process with a higher barrier to posting requests.
    - 11y ago
andy_ppp 11y ago
Taking this great idea a step further, I'd love to see projects.ycombinator.com which could eventually be submitted as YC proposals. I wonder if YC need any help building such a tool... I'd be game to help if others want to?
swalsh 11y ago
I had an idea a while ago to build a website where open source projects could make very specific requests. If it was something that another project needed as well, it would get a "bump" of some sort. If it was in small bitsized chunks, i'd definitely surf it looking for easy things I could contribute that could help a few people. Even better is if the site could certify it helped them, and I could get some kind of tax credit for it :D
nadams 11y ago
> I, for one, want to at least see, if not help, what small but interesting byte-size hurdles others encounter and how others can solve it in different ways, and all the discussion around it. I've thought about this idea and I think without proper "project managers" (I don't mean someone with a project management degree - but just someone to coordinate all the efforts) it seems like it could be a total failure. Here is an example: I have a C++ game engine that I need help with feature X. I think any C++ developer could come up with an implementation of X, but does the style fit my game engine? Does it interconnect with the rest of the engine? (of course ignoring the fact that any discussion of C++ would generate gigabytes worth of comments - I've read some of the newsgroup discussions on style alone...). You can't just be like "create a logging interface" without having studied the rest of the code base. It would be like trying to create a feature for Apache or Linux kernel - if we didn't study their code base and style anything we submit would be laughed out the room - not because what we did won't work or wrong but it doesn't fit with the rest of the code. This is where the project managers come in - they already know the style and inner workings and take what you submit and hack it into the right style and push it into a SCM or push it upstream (or reject it). Personally I would feel more inclined to make contributions to the Linux kernel if there was a friendly middle man I could look over my work before it gets to Linus - only because I fear if I submit something stupid I'll get chewed out by Linus. Even if this were to happen - I would not want to read 10k comments of tail call recursion optimization, smart pointer usage, or discussion of non-portable code that will work on 99% of systems except for AIX Unix and Blue Gene/Q.

iwillinc 11y ago

This is such a good god damn idea.

logicrime 11y ago

Yeah, what harm could come of asking people interested in news aggregation to complete tasks they have little interest in and little reason to do so? Surely the overall quality of HN won't suffer even more from people asking other hackers to write their C for them, what a great idea! fucking /s

theVirginian 11y ago
If you don't like it then don't participate. Some of these projects might be interesting. Unlike you apparently I actually like programming and do have an interest in taking part.
synthmeat 11y ago
Uninteresting tasks won't get upvoted. Interesting tasks get upvoted, and become a story in itself. Surely it won't have as detrimental effect as anonymous throwaway accounts rich with shallow sarcasm and curse words.
- logicrime 11y ago
  The truth hurts, but lies kill. The large majority of HN readers are lurkers, who don't vote at all, the next largest group are those who aren't able to downvote, followed by the smallest group, the downvote-capable. I've got a few accounts that have downvote and dozens without, but it's not enough to stop the constant barrage of stupidity that floods what is supposed to be a news aggregation list. I don't mind seeing SHOW HN:'s, I like seeing what hackers are working on. On the other hand, a bunch of posts TASK HN: Write a C wrapper because I can't do it, that's gonna get old real fuckin' quick. I will shill as hard as I can, but I fear that it won't be enough.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
happyscrappy 11y ago
Seeing the same problem solved in different ways is one of the best ways to learn. Cynicism is intellectual junk food.
tomjen3 11y ago
I share your concern, but if the tasks are of little interests and there are no great reason to do them, surely they will not be upvoted? HN has always been a bit more than a news aggregator, there are "Tell HN"s and "Show HN"s too.

pmorici 11y ago

Sounds like that would devolve into a situation where people are trying to exploit others for free work. There are plenty of places on the Internet where you can go to find people asking others to write software for them for little or no money. Should this really be one of them?

synthmeat 11y ago
I believe the same trend like in any (most) other non-news submissions will follow - intellectually stimulating tasks get upvoted.
philippnagel 11y ago
Upvoting/downvoting should, at least in theory, prevent that from happening.
- brudgers 11y ago
  The best form of moderation is not encouraging behavior that requires moderation. Downvotes are a form of community feedback but not really a moderation tool. For example, in cases where I am in doubt about the benefit of something to HN, my threshold for downvoting is much larger than my threshold for upvoting: I am more likely to upvote when "it might be useful" than to downvote a "might not be useful" because there is a person's karma at the other end of the arrow.
- ed_blackburn 11y ago
  Absolutely. Apply judgement.
- aw3c2 11y ago
  There is no downvoting at HN
kryptiskt 11y ago
If the result is open source I don't see that as a huge problem.
- 11y ago

brudgers 11y ago

I agree with the sentiment. Leveraging the skill and goodwill of the community is a great idea and anything that reduces the friction for volunteers is a good idea. On The other hand, I think there is little to be gained from frictionless requests for volunteers. That invites spam and low quality requests because there's nothing to lose. A linked blog post with technical details and relevant context is probably the ideal level of impedence with the HN format. The format of this request is a nice hack, but standardizing on a kludge is not the way to go. Maybe the structure is a monthly "Can you help?" thread...and perhaps a complimentary "Can I help?" thread.

synthmeat 11y ago
> That invites spam and low quality requests because there's nothing to lose. I think you may be underestimating desire for geek cred. Non-throwaway account would have little incentive to just spam with trivial tasks because they won't be upvoted, might even be flagged, and are tarnishing individuals reputation. You may have a point about format not being ideal and having too little friction. Not sure. > Maybe the structure is a monthly "Can you help?" thread...and perhaps a complimentary "Can I help?" thread. This most certainly wouldn't work for these types of requests, as they are rarely in opportunity to be scheduled for the next month, or at the very least, get solved by then by ugly hacks. Again, not sure what would emerge out of it really.
- brudgers 11y ago
  I've seen plenty of behavior outside community norms from non-throwaway accounts on HN. Including my own. If an open source project can't schedule major features a month out, then throwing more bodies at it won't solve the fundamental problem of disorganization and isn't prepared to make appropriate use of volunteer's time in ways that really value that time. Structuring policy around a continuous stream of "emergencies" invites low quality requests. A policy which parallels HN's job listing policy favors HN members rather than people for whom everything above zero euros is paying too much. The HN community benefits from a slower process with a higher barrier to posting requests.
  - 11y ago

andy_ppp 11y ago

Taking this great idea a step further, I'd love to see projects.ycombinator.com which could eventually be submitted as YC proposals. I wonder if YC need any help building such a tool... I'd be game to help if others want to?

swalsh 11y ago

I had an idea a while ago to build a website where open source projects could make very specific requests. If it was something that another project needed as well, it would get a "bump" of some sort. If it was in small bitsized chunks, i'd definitely surf it looking for easy things I could contribute that could help a few people. Even better is if the site could certify it helped them, and I could get some kind of tax credit for it :D

nadams 11y ago

> I, for one, want to at least see, if not help, what small but interesting byte-size hurdles others encounter and how others can solve it in different ways, and all the discussion around it. I've thought about this idea and I think without proper "project managers" (I don't mean someone with a project management degree - but just someone to coordinate all the efforts) it seems like it could be a total failure. Here is an example: I have a C++ game engine that I need help with feature X. I think any C++ developer could come up with an implementation of X, but does the style fit my game engine? Does it interconnect with the rest of the engine? (of course ignoring the fact that any discussion of C++ would generate gigabytes worth of comments - I've read some of the newsgroup discussions on style alone...). You can't just be like "create a logging interface" without having studied the rest of the code base. It would be like trying to create a feature for Apache or Linux kernel - if we didn't study their code base and style anything we submit would be laughed out the room - not because what we did won't work or wrong but it doesn't fit with the rest of the code. This is where the project managers come in - they already know the style and inner workings and take what you submit and hack it into the right style and push it into a SCM or push it upstream (or reject it). Personally I would feel more inclined to make contributions to the Linux kernel if there was a friendly middle man I could look over my work before it gets to Linus - only because I fear if I submit something stupid I'll get chewed out by Linus. Even if this were to happen - I would not want to read 10k comments of tail call recursion optimization, smart pointer usage, or discussion of non-portable code that will work on 99% of systems except for AIX Unix and Blue Gene/Q.