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I personally think Telsa's car business is bound to fail when the majors decide to compete. But that's a more long term strategy.

by x5n1 11y ago

Joona 11y ago
Why couldn't Tesla become the Ferrari of electric cars?
- mikeash 11y ago
  Because its CEO won't settle for that, and will insist on making it to the mass market or die trying.
- mlakewood 11y ago
  I think the real question is why would it want to? Ferrari is a specialist marque that, like most other super luxury brands, the parent company (in this case Fiat I believe) keeps around for the glow it gives its cheaper cars. There really isnt a lot of money is super expensive cars compared to the mass market. Have a look at the history of all the expensive car companies.. none of them are still standing.
epistasis 11y ago
Having dealt with lots of the "majors'" new car models lately in rentals, I doubt that they have much to bring to the table anymore. The amount of stupidity in design is astounding. I think that once Tesla scales, it will completely demolish any of the other US car companies. Toyota and Honda may be able to compete. I'm really really hungry for competence in both manufacturing and design, which is something that is sorely lacking in the current large US car companies. Based on their current track record, Tesla has a much better chance of delivering than Ford or GM.
- kbenson 11y ago
  > Having dealt with lots of the "majors'" new car models lately in rentals, I doubt that they have much to bring to the table anymore. I think it's more a matter of being shortsighted. If the ads from this season of the Startup podcast are any indication, they are so busy focusing on small pieces of the experience (such as having designing wear suits to simulate feeling old, etc) that they are missing the major advances. It's somewhat understandable, the major automakers have been making basically interchangeable cars for a few years, so spending time to enhance the entire experience in many small ways seems to make sense. That is, until some upstart shows up with something radically better.
  - epistasis 11y ago
    They're definitely short-sighted, but I think that's just the most optimistic outlook, I think the short-sightedness is hiding much deeper incompetence in management. Their computer systems are universally terrible, they have no clue how to build something like a UI for a car. This is not something that MBA-type management can buy their way out of, because they have no competence, and no way to evaluate the contractors that may be able to build something real, and in fact they are likely to be taken in by poor contractors that are great at sales and terrible at engineering. The management also has no clue how to build/empower an internal team that could do the same, as far as I can tell.
    - forgetsusername 11y ago
      >Their computer systems are universally terrible, they have no clue how to build something like a UI for a car. Like a lot of legacy systems, right? Tesla has an advantage of starting from scratch, sure. "This is not something that MBA-type management can buy their way out of, because they have no competence," No competence? These are century old companies that have created vast amounts of global wealth and emply hundreds of thousnads of people in what are still well-paying jobs. Yeah, no competence whatsoever. Of course, I suppose if you knew that Tesla has hired engineers and managers from some of these companies that have "no competence"...
      - epistasis 11y ago
        Extending an inadequate legacy system rather than starting from scratch is a perfect example of the incompetence in management that I'm talking about. Not sure why you're talking about engineers when I'm clearly talking about management. Also, today's management is not the management that built the companies or their wealth, so it's specious to suggest that that has any relevance on the evaluation of the current management. And finally, Tesla hiring the few competent managers is not a sign that those that remain at the current car companies are, as a whole, competent. While there are certainly individual managers that are competent in GM or Ford, the structure as a whole does not make good decisions, in my opinion.
      - 11y ago
- forgetsusername 11y ago
  >The amount of stupidity in design is astounding Please, elaborate on all the design stupidity that the Tesla solves. I've test driven a Tesla. It's awesome, thanks to the amazing torque delivery that comes from electric motors. It's a paradigm shift for a long time car guy, and has to be experienced to be understood. ..but, other than that...it's just a luxury car. What exactly has it "solved" that every other car company is still doing "stupidly"?
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - threeseed 11y ago
    The Tesla is not a luxury car. It may have a luxury price and technically it is very impressive but the interior quality is ridiculously poor for a car this expensive. I've sat in Hyundai and Daewoos that had better quality finishes and leathers.
explorigin 11y ago
Tesla has already won this war by providing parts to Toyota. The only winners in war are the weapons factories.
imdsm 11y ago
You're allowed your opinion. I think the "majors" are too bloated to produce anything other than a mass produced clone. I unfortunately bought one of these cars recently, only because the Tesla isn't quite ready for me or my area yet. When it is, I'll happily drop the majors for a Tesla.
jkestner 11y ago
I see the Chevy Bolt being hyped, like the Volt before it. The ferocity of this push in the media, without actual sales results, says that they're practicing FUD and that Tesla's bigger challenge remains making their shipping targets.
ajays 11y ago
The majors have not been able to put out a decent, reliable car in ~100 years, and you expect them to crush Tesla, a pioneer in the space?

I personally think Telsa's car business is bound to fail when the majors decide to compete. But that's a more long term strategy.

by x5n1 11y ago

I personally think Telsa's car business is bound to fail when the majors decide to compete. But that's a more long term strategy.

Joona 11y ago

Why couldn't Tesla become the Ferrari of electric cars?

mikeash 11y ago
Because its CEO won't settle for that, and will insist on making it to the mass market or die trying.
mlakewood 11y ago
I think the real question is why would it want to? Ferrari is a specialist marque that, like most other super luxury brands, the parent company (in this case Fiat I believe) keeps around for the glow it gives its cheaper cars. There really isnt a lot of money is super expensive cars compared to the mass market. Have a look at the history of all the expensive car companies.. none of them are still standing.

epistasis 11y ago

Having dealt with lots of the "majors'" new car models lately in rentals, I doubt that they have much to bring to the table anymore. The amount of stupidity in design is astounding. I think that once Tesla scales, it will completely demolish any of the other US car companies. Toyota and Honda may be able to compete. I'm really really hungry for competence in both manufacturing and design, which is something that is sorely lacking in the current large US car companies. Based on their current track record, Tesla has a much better chance of delivering than Ford or GM.

kbenson 11y ago
> Having dealt with lots of the "majors'" new car models lately in rentals, I doubt that they have much to bring to the table anymore. I think it's more a matter of being shortsighted. If the ads from this season of the Startup podcast are any indication, they are so busy focusing on small pieces of the experience (such as having designing wear suits to simulate feeling old, etc) that they are missing the major advances. It's somewhat understandable, the major automakers have been making basically interchangeable cars for a few years, so spending time to enhance the entire experience in many small ways seems to make sense. That is, until some upstart shows up with something radically better.
- epistasis 11y ago
  They're definitely short-sighted, but I think that's just the most optimistic outlook, I think the short-sightedness is hiding much deeper incompetence in management. Their computer systems are universally terrible, they have no clue how to build something like a UI for a car. This is not something that MBA-type management can buy their way out of, because they have no competence, and no way to evaluate the contractors that may be able to build something real, and in fact they are likely to be taken in by poor contractors that are great at sales and terrible at engineering. The management also has no clue how to build/empower an internal team that could do the same, as far as I can tell.
  - forgetsusername 11y ago
    >Their computer systems are universally terrible, they have no clue how to build something like a UI for a car. Like a lot of legacy systems, right? Tesla has an advantage of starting from scratch, sure. "This is not something that MBA-type management can buy their way out of, because they have no competence," No competence? These are century old companies that have created vast amounts of global wealth and emply hundreds of thousnads of people in what are still well-paying jobs. Yeah, no competence whatsoever. Of course, I suppose if you knew that Tesla has hired engineers and managers from some of these companies that have "no competence"...
    - epistasis 11y ago
      Extending an inadequate legacy system rather than starting from scratch is a perfect example of the incompetence in management that I'm talking about. Not sure why you're talking about engineers when I'm clearly talking about management. Also, today's management is not the management that built the companies or their wealth, so it's specious to suggest that that has any relevance on the evaluation of the current management. And finally, Tesla hiring the few competent managers is not a sign that those that remain at the current car companies are, as a whole, competent. While there are certainly individual managers that are competent in GM or Ford, the structure as a whole does not make good decisions, in my opinion.
    - 11y ago
forgetsusername 11y ago
>The amount of stupidity in design is astounding Please, elaborate on all the design stupidity that the Tesla solves. I've test driven a Tesla. It's awesome, thanks to the amazing torque delivery that comes from electric motors. It's a paradigm shift for a long time car guy, and has to be experienced to be understood. ..but, other than that...it's just a luxury car. What exactly has it "solved" that every other car company is still doing "stupidly"?
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- threeseed 11y ago
  The Tesla is not a luxury car. It may have a luxury price and technically it is very impressive but the interior quality is ridiculously poor for a car this expensive. I've sat in Hyundai and Daewoos that had better quality finishes and leathers.

explorigin 11y ago

Tesla has already won this war by providing parts to Toyota. The only winners in war are the weapons factories.

imdsm 11y ago

You're allowed your opinion. I think the "majors" are too bloated to produce anything other than a mass produced clone. I unfortunately bought one of these cars recently, only because the Tesla isn't quite ready for me or my area yet. When it is, I'll happily drop the majors for a Tesla.

jkestner 11y ago

I see the Chevy Bolt being hyped, like the Volt before it. The ferocity of this push in the media, without actual sales results, says that they're practicing FUD and that Tesla's bigger challenge remains making their shipping targets.

ajays 11y ago

The majors have not been able to put out a decent, reliable car in ~100 years, and you expect them to crush Tesla, a pioneer in the space?