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The model X is the bogeyman in Tesla's house. If they fail to start deliveries by September as they have indicated they will likely not make their sales goal fo

The model X is the bogeyman in Tesla's house. If they fail to start deliveries by September as they have indicated they will likely not make their sales goal for year. The suspect in the X delay is the gull wing doors which like the ragtop they had before, Elon's insistence on particular features again is causing production issues.

giarc 11y ago
Elon's decision to keep the gull wing doors is awesome though. The concept had them and he believes that a company shouldn't show one concept with cool features, then deliver the actual car without those cool features. All the other auto companies do it and it's incredibly disappointing.
- cma 11y ago
  Companies put stuff on concepts knowing they won't make it to production. If his concept had them and they just couldn't make it work out but they legitimately tried, that doesn't seem as bad.
  - giarc 11y ago
    I guess it depends on the idea of the concept car vs show piece of future production. I think some of the concept cars that GM/Ford/Dodge sometimes display are obviously concept cars that will never see the light of day. However, Tesla isn't really at that stage. So when they show a concept, it needs to be closer to reality. Toyota had a concept Rav 4 a few years ago that I really liked and had hoped they would put into production, they never did and it was extremely disappointing. I guess what I'm saying is, if it's going to be a concept car, make it so outlandish that no one will believe it will be production.
pbreit 11y ago
"Elon's insistence" has also created a $35b company. I think anyone would happily delay a car launch to both improve the car and increase the company's long term value.
- ElComradio 11y ago
  A high-risk $500M loan from Uncle Sam (read: You and me, against our knowledge or direct choice) has created a $35B company, in which we the investor have no stake.
  - gitah 11y ago
    That's the difference between loaning money and buying equity in a company.
    - ElComradio 11y ago
      We should have insisted on owning a stake, given the risky nature of the loan, and the size, at the very least.
      - kbenson 11y ago
        Large government loans to big industries are not uncommon. Ford secured a 5.9 billion dollar loan from the government in 2009 (not a bailout, a loan to retool factories).
        ElComradio 11y ago
        That's not right either, but at least it's less wrong, as Ford had a far greater chance of repayment. Government just should not be making loans like this to private entities at all.
  - mikeash 11y ago
    Better than blowing another $1 trillion on another pointless Mideast war or a fighter jet that can't fight. If making a $500 million loan that not only gets paid back but produces a valuable and productive American company is the worst thing my government did today, I'd count us all extremely lucky.
  - randomaxes 11y ago
    US Govt will collect at least 15% capital gains on that 35B plus 20-40% of the salaries. It's not equity, but it's pretty close.
mikeash 11y ago
Yes, the Model X is a big question mark for now. I think September may finally be it, because it's getting very close and there's no sign that it's going to slip. Model X will tell us whether Tesla can pull it off again, or whether the Model S was just a fluke. I think/hope they can, but it's probably fair to say that the company is riding on it at the moment.
gokhan 11y ago
"Elon's insistence" (or Steve's insistence, for example) on particular features sometimes make great products. In the past he proved many times that he can deliver.
- Florin_Andrei 11y ago
  Well, it's called "insistence" when it comes from an average person. But when it comes from a visionary genius like Steve or Elon (or the likes of Larry Page for that matter), it's really something else.
  - kbenson 11y ago
    When the outcome is negative, it's insistence. When the outcome is positive, it's rebranded as genius.
Animats 11y ago
Well, there's the "disappearing door" option.[1] Sadly, this never seems to have made it into a production vehicle. It wouldn't work for Tesla's cars anyway; they need that underfloor space for the battery. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loshV54nHeQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loshV54nHeQ

giarc 11y ago

Elon's decision to keep the gull wing doors is awesome though. The concept had them and he believes that a company shouldn't show one concept with cool features, then deliver the actual car without those cool features. All the other auto companies do it and it's incredibly disappointing.

cma 11y ago
Companies put stuff on concepts knowing they won't make it to production. If his concept had them and they just couldn't make it work out but they legitimately tried, that doesn't seem as bad.
- giarc 11y ago
  I guess it depends on the idea of the concept car vs show piece of future production. I think some of the concept cars that GM/Ford/Dodge sometimes display are obviously concept cars that will never see the light of day. However, Tesla isn't really at that stage. So when they show a concept, it needs to be closer to reality. Toyota had a concept Rav 4 a few years ago that I really liked and had hoped they would put into production, they never did and it was extremely disappointing. I guess what I'm saying is, if it's going to be a concept car, make it so outlandish that no one will believe it will be production.

pbreit 11y ago

"Elon's insistence" has also created a $35b company. I think anyone would happily delay a car launch to both improve the car and increase the company's long term value.

ElComradio 11y ago
A high-risk $500M loan from Uncle Sam (read: You and me, against our knowledge or direct choice) has created a $35B company, in which we the investor have no stake.
- gitah 11y ago
  That's the difference between loaning money and buying equity in a company.
  - ElComradio 11y ago
    We should have insisted on owning a stake, given the risky nature of the loan, and the size, at the very least.
    - kbenson 11y ago
      Large government loans to big industries are not uncommon. Ford secured a 5.9 billion dollar loan from the government in 2009 (not a bailout, a loan to retool factories).
      - ElComradio 11y ago
        That's not right either, but at least it's less wrong, as Ford had a far greater chance of repayment. Government just should not be making loans like this to private entities at all.
- mikeash 11y ago
  Better than blowing another $1 trillion on another pointless Mideast war or a fighter jet that can't fight. If making a $500 million loan that not only gets paid back but produces a valuable and productive American company is the worst thing my government did today, I'd count us all extremely lucky.
- randomaxes 11y ago
  US Govt will collect at least 15% capital gains on that 35B plus 20-40% of the salaries. It's not equity, but it's pretty close.

mikeash 11y ago

Yes, the Model X is a big question mark for now. I think September may finally be it, because it's getting very close and there's no sign that it's going to slip. Model X will tell us whether Tesla can pull it off again, or whether the Model S was just a fluke. I think/hope they can, but it's probably fair to say that the company is riding on it at the moment.

gokhan 11y ago

"Elon's insistence" (or Steve's insistence, for example) on particular features sometimes make great products. In the past he proved many times that he can deliver.

Florin_Andrei 11y ago
Well, it's called "insistence" when it comes from an average person. But when it comes from a visionary genius like Steve or Elon (or the likes of Larry Page for that matter), it's really something else.
- kbenson 11y ago
  When the outcome is negative, it's insistence. When the outcome is positive, it's rebranded as genius.

Animats 11y ago

Well, there's the "disappearing door" option.[1] Sadly, this never seems to have made it into a production vehicle. It wouldn't work for Tesla's cars anyway; they need that underfloor space for the battery. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loshV54nHeQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loshV54nHeQ