5 ms·

Why would you ever hire women to guard men? I see absolutely no upside and massive risks.

by blfr 11y ago

jonknee 11y ago
Tell that to the male guard who also helped them escape in trade for some original artwork... It's a people problem, not a sex problem.
- blfr 11y ago
  Of course it's a people problem but you have to hire someone, at least for now. Women not only vastly expand the risk of romantic involvement, they're also physically weaker. And you don't get anything in return for taking these additional risks.
  - ghaff 11y ago
    I suspect that it would not be legal to refuse to hire women because "they expand the risk of romantic involvement" and "are physically weaker" (even though they meet the requirements of the position). I don't actually disagree with your points but variations of them have frequently been the excuse for excluding women from a wide variety of jobs.
  - agentgt 11y ago
    I am by no means a strong feminist but I find it pretty stupid to decide whether or not to hire based on gender (unless of course the gender is absolutely required like female lead in a movie). I have seen many women far more physically capable to handle jobs like that then men. Hire the best person for the job regardless of gender.
  - jessaustin 11y ago
    ...at least for now. I suspect that when everything is robots, and the judge and jury just press a button and forget about the rest, prisons will be even more horrific than they are now, only it will be 10% of the population in them rather than 1%.
  - bruceb 11y ago
    Women generally are less conflict prone then men. How many bar fights are between women?
- bruceb 11y ago
  The male guard did not help them escape he just was doing them favors to get art work from them. He didn't know they were going to try and escape. The authorities seems to believe him, the reason his bond is only $25k. http://www.torontosun.com/2015/06/24/2nd-prison-guard-arrested-after-new-york-inmates-escape http://www.torontosun.com/2015/06/24/2nd-prison-guard-arrest...
omegaham 11y ago
A few reasons: 1. The benefit of a larger talent pool to recruit from is easy to measure, and the drawbacks (having to fire a large number of them and increased contraband in the prison from said compromised COs) are harder to measure. 2. It's politically unpalatable to segregate by gender. The vast majority of female COs wash out within their first year; either they can't take the pressure, or they start showing favoritism toward the more charismatic inmates. The reason is pretty simple - women are fucked with more than men. For whatever reason, when a male CO gigs an inmate, the inmate knows that it's The Man keeping him down and not the man. In contrast, when a female CO gigs an inmate, the inmate tries harder to get out of it because he perceives weakness. As a result, more female COs crack. This actually happens with all staff, not just guards. Nurses, instructors, whatever - all of them get routinely compromised. It's a very, very difficult problem to hire people for relatively low wages, stick them with people who have nothing better to do, and expect everyone to remain professional. The optimal male CO is an unthinking robot. "Sorry, you violated Rule 131. I have to write you up. No exceptions." In contrast, the optimal female CO is a "crazy dyke psycho bitch" who takes pleasure (or appears to take pleasure) in making prisoners' lives hell. They won't respect a woman who acts otherwise. Again, this is because inmates respect The Man but take it personally when a woman tells them No. So, the woman has to show that she will not ever let them off because she enjoys making them suffer. Source: Girlfriend worked corrections for a while. Her "prison attitude" is hilarious. "I prefer corrections to bartending. When customers at the bar sexually harass / assault you, you have to smile and take it. When inmates sexually harass you, you put them in solitary and forget to refill their pain med prescription. Whoops."
- soup10 11y ago
  Real answer: prisons are horrific and nobody in their right mind wants to work there so they take whoever they can get Also your girlfriend sounds crazy, nothing funny about abusing people
  - leesalminen 11y ago
    Agreed x100. Your girlfriend sounds crazy.
  - 11y ago
Retra 11y ago
You shouldn't be relying on physical stature to secure people.
bsder 11y ago
Prison guard is a tough job with a lot of turnover. You don't necessarily have the largest employment pool to pick from--especially since prisons are often located in rural or out of the way places. 2x the candidates is a good idea.
Spooky23 11y ago
The female employee wasn't a CO and wasn't guarding anyone. She was a seamstress, working in the tailor shop in the prison where the escapees worked. This is a situation of bad management and people asleep at the switch running the place -- at best. At worst, the entire staff from top to bottom is completely corrupt. Every detail revealed thus far has been things that have multiple layers of controls that were supposed to prevent such an event. There's no way that people are cooking burgers on hotplates in cells (with convict electricians wiring cells to enable said cooking) without people knowing about it. It's pretty easy to find hotplates that don't belong. Outside food was contraband, and the guards were almost certainly doing a brisk business in smuggling.

Why would you ever hire women to guard men? I see absolutely no upside and massive risks.

by blfr 11y ago

Why would you ever hire women to guard men? I see absolutely no upside and massive risks.

Tell that to the male guard who also helped them escape in trade for some original artwork... It's a people problem, not a sex problem.

blfr 11y ago
Of course it's a people problem but you have to hire someone, at least for now. Women not only vastly expand the risk of romantic involvement, they're also physically weaker. And you don't get anything in return for taking these additional risks.
- ghaff 11y ago
  I suspect that it would not be legal to refuse to hire women because "they expand the risk of romantic involvement" and "are physically weaker" (even though they meet the requirements of the position). I don't actually disagree with your points but variations of them have frequently been the excuse for excluding women from a wide variety of jobs.
- agentgt 11y ago
  I am by no means a strong feminist but I find it pretty stupid to decide whether or not to hire based on gender (unless of course the gender is absolutely required like female lead in a movie). I have seen many women far more physically capable to handle jobs like that then men. Hire the best person for the job regardless of gender.
- jessaustin 11y ago
  ...at least for now. I suspect that when everything is robots, and the judge and jury just press a button and forget about the rest, prisons will be even more horrific than they are now, only it will be 10% of the population in them rather than 1%.
- bruceb 11y ago
  Women generally are less conflict prone then men. How many bar fights are between women?
bruceb 11y ago
The male guard did not help them escape he just was doing them favors to get art work from them. He didn't know they were going to try and escape. The authorities seems to believe him, the reason his bond is only $25k. http://www.torontosun.com/2015/06/24/2nd-prison-guard-arrested-after-new-york-inmates-escape http://www.torontosun.com/2015/06/24/2nd-prison-guard-arrest...

omegaham 11y ago

A few reasons: 1. The benefit of a larger talent pool to recruit from is easy to measure, and the drawbacks (having to fire a large number of them and increased contraband in the prison from said compromised COs) are harder to measure. 2. It's politically unpalatable to segregate by gender. The vast majority of female COs wash out within their first year; either they can't take the pressure, or they start showing favoritism toward the more charismatic inmates. The reason is pretty simple - women are fucked with more than men. For whatever reason, when a male CO gigs an inmate, the inmate knows that it's The Man keeping him down and not the man. In contrast, when a female CO gigs an inmate, the inmate tries harder to get out of it because he perceives weakness. As a result, more female COs crack. This actually happens with all staff, not just guards. Nurses, instructors, whatever - all of them get routinely compromised. It's a very, very difficult problem to hire people for relatively low wages, stick them with people who have nothing better to do, and expect everyone to remain professional. The optimal male CO is an unthinking robot. "Sorry, you violated Rule 131. I have to write you up. No exceptions." In contrast, the optimal female CO is a "crazy dyke psycho bitch" who takes pleasure (or appears to take pleasure) in making prisoners' lives hell. They won't respect a woman who acts otherwise. Again, this is because inmates respect The Man but take it personally when a woman tells them No. So, the woman has to show that she will not ever let them off because she enjoys making them suffer. Source: Girlfriend worked corrections for a while. Her "prison attitude" is hilarious. "I prefer corrections to bartending. When customers at the bar sexually harass / assault you, you have to smile and take it. When inmates sexually harass you, you put them in solitary and forget to refill their pain med prescription. Whoops."

soup10 11y ago
Real answer: prisons are horrific and nobody in their right mind wants to work there so they take whoever they can get Also your girlfriend sounds crazy, nothing funny about abusing people
- leesalminen 11y ago
  Agreed x100. Your girlfriend sounds crazy.
- 11y ago

Retra 11y ago

You shouldn't be relying on physical stature to secure people.

bsder 11y ago

Prison guard is a tough job with a lot of turnover. You don't necessarily have the largest employment pool to pick from--especially since prisons are often located in rural or out of the way places. 2x the candidates is a good idea.

Spooky23 11y ago

The female employee wasn't a CO and wasn't guarding anyone. She was a seamstress, working in the tailor shop in the prison where the escapees worked. This is a situation of bad management and people asleep at the switch running the place -- at best. At worst, the entire staff from top to bottom is completely corrupt. Every detail revealed thus far has been things that have multiple layers of controls that were supposed to prevent such an event. There's no way that people are cooking burgers on hotplates in cells (with convict electricians wiring cells to enable said cooking) without people knowing about it. It's pretty easy to find hotplates that don't belong. Outside food was contraband, and the guards were almost certainly doing a brisk business in smuggling.