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Programmer Salaries in SF, by Language (2009)
- nearestneighbor 17y agoSame for NYC: http://preview.tinyurl.com/nycsalaries http://preview.tinyurl.com/nycsalaries
- deleted 17y ago[deleted]
- aaronblohowiak 17y agoThis should be adjusted for years of experience.
- simanyay 17y agoWait, what? Cobol in San Francisco?
- gaius 17y agoWhere there's banking, there's COBOL.
- simanyay 17y agoOh, according to http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=title:(Programmer,+Python)&l=San+Francisco,+CA http://www.indeed.com/jobs?q=title:(Programmer,+Python)&... these stats for Python programmers came from four job postings with five postings total (I guess the fifth one is without salary). Not too impressive.
- nearestneighbor 17y agoYou can edit or remove the location. Better statistics <-> less specificity.
- aaronblohowiak 17y agoWhat does <-> mean in your post?
- derefr 17y agoBiconditional/implies in both directions?
- nearestneighbor 17y agoYep. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-order_logic#Logical_symbols http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-order_logic#Logical_symbo...
- ggrot 17y agomatlab?
- cema 17y agoWhy not? Scientific models, statistical calculations, etc.
- deleted 17y ago[deleted]
- pg 17y agoThis data looks like noise.
- rudyfink 17y agoI'm suspicious. It has a salary profile for both a "hitman" http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=hitman&l1=San+Francisco%2C+CA http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=hitman&l1=San+Francisco%... and "God" http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=God+&l1=San+Francisco%2C+CA http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=God+&l1=San+Francisco%2C....
- deleted 17y ago[deleted]
- ntoshev 17y agoDoes this mean the data don't correlate with you experience, or you have a more general test? They look reasonable to me at a first glance...
- herdrick 17y agoShould have used sparklines. Also, all that variation over only 18 months doesn't inspire confidence.
- j_baker 17y agoI feel sorry for the Basic programmer making $49,000 a year in San Francisco.
- catch23 17y agoFYI, BGI in San Francisco (large institutional investor firm) uses visual basic on their core trading platform (handles all instrument classes). Their visual basic developers there make more than 100k. Their bonuses are big too -- 50% of their salary usually.
- strlen 17y agoWouldn't this data be seriously skewed by not including Silicon Valley where a lot of developers in San Francisco commute to? Silicon Valley has much less financial companies, most of established tech companies, many start-ups? [Edit: added this] I'd imagine the (more established tech companies, less financial companies) should seriously skew the supply/demand for developers. Of course, the data is noisy and many of the samples are statistically insignificant.
- nostrademons 17y agoI just did listings for Mountain View and they were basically the same. Off by maybe $1-2K. The language pattern was the same: C had the highest salaries, then C++, Python, Ruby were all fairly high, Java was a bit less, Basic was the least.
- adatta02 17y agohttp://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=bush+league&l1= http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=bush+league&l1=
- seasoup 17y agoWhich javascript library does it pay the most to know? http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=Programmer%2C+prototype&l1=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q2=Programmer%2C+jquery&l2=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q3=Programmer%2C+mootools&l3=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q4=Programmer%2C+dojo&l4=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q5=Programmer%2C+yui&l5=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q6=Programmer%2C+gwt&l6=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q7=Programmer%2C+extjs&l7=San+Francisco%2C+CA&tm=1 http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=Programmer%2C+prototype&...
- Tuna-Fish 17y agoUnclick the "search job titles only" for this one, gets you much better data.
- paddy_m 17y agoIf that is your question, I would hope that you make much less than the average salary for that library.
- derwiki 17y agoLike it or not, Javascript is one of the most important languages around. It's also the language that people feel they can code without knowing -- hence all the shoddy JS out there. While it's not perfect, JS frameworks help, and I think someone should be looked down upon for wanting to know which one is the best use of their time.
- seasoup 17y agolaughs Come on paddy_m, it was mostly a joke. Last year at work, we compared lots of javascript libraries out there and discovered that they are mostly pretty difficult to compare. You have to get past the similarities and style semantics to discover which one to use. Some points of comparison I thought were not too valuable had traction with developers while some that I thought were important were not. This was just another inane data point showing the current popularity of various javascript libraries. One thing that is ironic is that, at least when I generated the statistics, the easiest to use library, jQuery, also had the highest paying jobs associated with it. I suppose ease of use generates higher usage, which means more popularity of the framework, which translates into higher pay for those that get it.
- DrJokepu 17y agoI wonder why C programmers make so much compared to other developers. Prbably because they are experts in some very specific domain and they happen to need C to fulfil their needs; they're really network stack developers, cryptohgraphy developers, compiler developers etc. So simply learning C wouldn't get you those salaries, both the fact that they use C and that they earn that much in comparison are the consequences of them being experts. Another example of correlation not being causation.
- deleted 17y ago[deleted]
- vlad 17y agoLike other users, I really, really wanted this submission to be accurate, because I am interested in salary information myself. However, that didn't stop me from questioning it. I've noticed that few submitters or commenters ever take a few minutes to question how the data might have been collected and/or measured before contributing. Here's a simple way to "test" results to see if any "bugs" exist. The user input could be misleading, the algorithms could be way off, or whatever. There is a lot of statistical terminology describing ways a conclusion could be flawed. Is the article is on the front page because it is accurate, or simply because users found it was novel? Is any of the results worth a damn? It's very simple to replace Programmer with Engineer to mix things up. This changed results as follows: C: (-24K), from 118K to 94K Matlab: (+33K), from 70K to 103K Also, the gap between Python and Ruby salaries increases from 8K to 19K. Python: (-4K), 92K to 88K Ruby: (+7K), from 100K to 107K http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=Engineer%2C+Java&l1=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q2=Engineer%2C+C%2B%2B&l2=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q3=Engineer%2C+C&l3=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q4=Engineer%2C+C%23&l4=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q5=Engineer%2C+Python&l5=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q6=Engineer%2C+Ruby&l6=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q7=Engineer%2C+Perl&l7=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q8=Engineer%2C+Basic&l8=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q9=Engineer%2C+Fortran&l9=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q10=Engineer%2C+Cobol&l10=San+Francisco%2C+CA&q11=Engineer%2C+Matlab&l11=San+Francisco%2C+CA&tm=1 http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=Engineer%2C+Java&l1=San+... Thus, instead of trying to derive meaning from nonsense, it's better to move on. EDIT: The submitter of this article has "machine learning" in the about section of his or her profile. Isn't that statistics? EDIT2: And if you unclick "search titles only" for my query, then Java, C++, C#, Python, Ruby, and Perl salaries are all 100K +/- $2K (99K to 102K.) One could probably create a query that shows anything they wanted...
- deleted 17y ago[deleted]
- vlad 17y agoThanks for the reply. Small sample size leads to greater variance, naturally. Better samples with no location: The point is, changing programmer to engineer changes the rankings and salaries dramatically. pg called it noise. don't assume that any links here withstood the submitter's professional scrutiny (are you serious?) It wasn't a link; my understanding is the submitter (who happened to be you) specifically typed in all those parameters themselves. I apologize for coming off a bit cross; I almost always avoid that. I'm not seeing this I said the query I posted (with Engineer), not yours. Anyway, it was a great idea, and anybody should be able to submit whatever they want and let the public judge; in this case, the post title seemed to overstate what it was showing. It was called "Salaries in SF (2009)", as if it was a report with analysis, but it was something linking to a search result, something likely to be different two weeks or two days from now. Maybe a blog post would have been better, as it would allow for multiple runs, analysis of the strengths and weaknesses of the methodology, and preserve the state of the results in the form of charts, as well.
- pwnstigator 17y agoNo one starts out anymore in C, but it's still widely useful in a lot of domains. So most C programmers: * are multilingual, * have a fair amount of programming experience, and * have ostensible experience with a difficult language. Out of curiosity, is there enough data to draw inferences regarding functional languages like SBCL, Ocaml, Haskell, and Clojure?
- jazzychad 17y agoFalse. I started out in C straight out of school 3 years ago. Like you say, it depends on the domain, but C is still used all over the place. I loved every minute of it (before I left my job to do my startup), but then again I may be insane :)
- pwnstigator 17y agoWere you programming before that job, though? What I meant to say is that few people start programming in C. It's usually Java, Python, or Ruby these days. Scheme occasionally.
- jazzychad 17y agoAh, I see what you meant: "No one starts learning to program in C anymore," correct? I thought you meant, "no one starts out their career in C." In that case, yes, I started programming in BASIC when I was very young, then several other languages, and then C during college.
- ramchip 17y agoDon't forget Basic, visual or not ;) Matlab is also very popular in engineering. Personally, I started with toy programs in QBasic that an uncle taught me, then playing around on the TI-80, then Matlab when I entered uni (first 'real' programming).
- spitfire 17y agoI removed the location and replaced COBOL with Ada - $133K national average apparently. All of the jobs require secret security clearance too. Sounds more interesting than a webapp.
- ShabbyDoo 17y agoI think a janitor with top secret clearance can make $50K.
- tybris 17y agoAre there really programming jobs where you only use one language? I'd prefer to work with people who use the right tool for the job. I work with C/Java/Perl on a daily basis and occasionally modify Ruby or Python. I've also used quite a lot of C# in the past. In general, I have no language preferences. It's just C# for Windows front-ends, Java for management layer, Perl for configuration, C for core software.
- jasonw22 17y agoSome of the data is very different if you substitute "Developer" or "Engineer" for "Programmer".
- dfrankow 17y agoSame link for Minneapolis. Retains the bump for C. http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=Programmer%2C+Java&l1=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q2=Programmer%2C+C%2B%2B&l2=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q3=Programmer%2C+C&l3=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q4=Programmer%2C+C%23&l4=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q5=Programmer%2C+Python&l5=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q6=Programmer%2C+Ruby&l6=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q7=Programmer%2C+Perl&l7=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q8=Programmer%2C+Basic&l8=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q9=Programmer%2C+Fortran&l9=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q10=Programmer%2C+Cobol&l10=Minneapolis%2C+MN&q11=Programmer%2C+Matlab&l11=Minneapolis%2C+MN&tm=1 http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=Programmer%2C+Java&l1=Mi...
- apsec112 17y agoLoads of these "statistics" are nonsense, don't pay any attention. http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=Corporate+lawyer&l1=New+York+City%2C+NY http://www.indeed.com/salary?q1=Corporate+lawyer&l1=New+...