4 ms·

“You could surmise that [the parts] are coming from the US, since most of the weapons that come down here illegally are from the US,” Perhaps, since the larges

by hga 11y ago

“You could surmise that [the parts] are coming from the US, since most of the weapons that come down here illegally are from the US,” Perhaps, since the largest US source is M16s (and maybe M4s now) donated to the Mexican government and then stolen (second is Communist bloc stuff bought on the open market, it's much less expensive than making your own like this). There's not much utility in tracing any of these guns, except of course to propagandize for gun control in the US (see Fast and Furious for the most egregious example). Which makes me wonder why this cartel felt a need to make their own AR-15s or M16s (the article didn't mention if these were 3 round burst or full auto, did it)? If they can get their hands on rocket propelled grenades.... Then again, this whole expose might be a lie (again, see Fast and Furious).

yohoho22 11y ago
> the largest US source is M16s (and maybe M4s now) donated to the Mexican government and then stolen Source for this claim? >second is Communist bloc stuff bought on the open market What market is that? >There's not much utility in tracing any of these guns, except of course to propagandize for gun control in the US (see Fast and Furious for the most egregious example). Are you actually claiming that "Fast and Furious" was an attempt to manufacture fodder for US domestic gun control efforts? > Which makes me wonder why this cartel felt a need to make their own AR-15s or M16s (the article didn't mention if these were 3 round burst or full auto, did it)? If they can get their hands on rocket propelled grenades.... Yeah, makes one wonder, doesn't it? >Then again, this whole expose might be a lie (again, see Fast and Furious). Maybe this whole post I'm replying to is the product of someone who is profoundly fucked in the head. Funny how utter garbage like you've produced here fares just fine on this site where the posters typically trip all over one another to be the most skeptical and supposedly clear-eyed. I guess you paranoid, mentally unbalanced gun creeps just freak them out enough that they simply stay away.
- hga 11y ago
  The only other theory about Fast and Furious that makes sense is that the ATF decided to supply one or more cartels with guns, either as a matter of national policy or internal ATF corruption, and the gun control propaganda was gravy. It certainly wasn't a law enforcement operation, seeing as it violated an ATF cardinal rule about giving guns to criminals.
joshuapants 11y ago
> Which makes me wonder why this cartel felt a need to make their own AR-15s or M16s (the article didn't mention if these were 3 round burst or full auto, did it)? If they can get their hands on rocket propelled grenades.... The use case for a rocket launcher is a bit different than the use case for a rifle. There is probably some overlap, but there are definitely situations where one is a far better choice than the other.
- gweinberg 11y ago
  Your missing the point. If the cartels can get RPGs from the Mexican military, they can get rifles from them also.
  - joshuapants 11y ago
    Oh. That makes a lot more sense now.
- hga 11y ago
  Sorry about my lack of clarity. My question is, what's behind their "make vs. buy" decision. They pretty much have to buy or steal RPGs if they want them, you really don't want to mess around with primary and secondary explosives unless you absolutely have to (or so I gather, I've steered clear of them, I like my hands intact), but if they can procure RPGs, they can much more easily procure rifles. Don't know what the cost for a AR-15 pattern rifles is, but I heard some time ago the price for an illicit AK-47 pattern rifle is around $100. Lack of access to Mexican military supplies (their fighting with the Los Zetas might suggest that) plus logistics might be part of the answer, the latter as in they'd probably rather smuggle more drugs into the country than some rifles, especially if demand for marijuana exported to the US is low (everything else is much smaller size and weight). This picture https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e8/Matazets-interrogationZetas.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e8/Matazets-inte... shows them armed with AR-15 pattern rifles and the guy in the front right has a LAW, which is a US Vietnam era one shot rocket launcher (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M72_LAW https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M72_LAW).
  - 11y ago

by hga 11y ago

yohoho22 11y ago

> the largest US source is M16s (and maybe M4s now) donated to the Mexican government and then stolen Source for this claim? >second is Communist bloc stuff bought on the open market What market is that? >There's not much utility in tracing any of these guns, except of course to propagandize for gun control in the US (see Fast and Furious for the most egregious example). Are you actually claiming that "Fast and Furious" was an attempt to manufacture fodder for US domestic gun control efforts? > Which makes me wonder why this cartel felt a need to make their own AR-15s or M16s (the article didn't mention if these were 3 round burst or full auto, did it)? If they can get their hands on rocket propelled grenades.... Yeah, makes one wonder, doesn't it? >Then again, this whole expose might be a lie (again, see Fast and Furious). Maybe this whole post I'm replying to is the product of someone who is profoundly fucked in the head. Funny how utter garbage like you've produced here fares just fine on this site where the posters typically trip all over one another to be the most skeptical and supposedly clear-eyed. I guess you paranoid, mentally unbalanced gun creeps just freak them out enough that they simply stay away.

hga 11y ago
The only other theory about Fast and Furious that makes sense is that the ATF decided to supply one or more cartels with guns, either as a matter of national policy or internal ATF corruption, and the gun control propaganda was gravy. It certainly wasn't a law enforcement operation, seeing as it violated an ATF cardinal rule about giving guns to criminals.

joshuapants 11y ago

> Which makes me wonder why this cartel felt a need to make their own AR-15s or M16s (the article didn't mention if these were 3 round burst or full auto, did it)? If they can get their hands on rocket propelled grenades.... The use case for a rocket launcher is a bit different than the use case for a rifle. There is probably some overlap, but there are definitely situations where one is a far better choice than the other.

gweinberg 11y ago
Your missing the point. If the cartels can get RPGs from the Mexican military, they can get rifles from them also.
- joshuapants 11y ago
  Oh. That makes a lot more sense now.
hga 11y ago
Sorry about my lack of clarity. My question is, what's behind their "make vs. buy" decision. They pretty much have to buy or steal RPGs if they want them, you really don't want to mess around with primary and secondary explosives unless you absolutely have to (or so I gather, I've steered clear of them, I like my hands intact), but if they can procure RPGs, they can much more easily procure rifles. Don't know what the cost for a AR-15 pattern rifles is, but I heard some time ago the price for an illicit AK-47 pattern rifle is around $100. Lack of access to Mexican military supplies (their fighting with the Los Zetas might suggest that) plus logistics might be part of the answer, the latter as in they'd probably rather smuggle more drugs into the country than some rifles, especially if demand for marijuana exported to the US is low (everything else is much smaller size and weight). This picture https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e8/Matazets-interrogationZetas.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e8/Matazets-inte... shows them armed with AR-15 pattern rifles and the guy in the front right has a LAW, which is a US Vietnam era one shot rocket launcher (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M72_LAW https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M72_LAW).
- 11y ago