3 ms·

Well, the nation certainly doesn't act secularly since they treat people differently based on their religion (the law of return, as an obvious example). And yo

by smanek 17y ago

Well, the nation certainly doesn't act secularly since they treat people differently based on their religion (the law of return, as an obvious example). And you're flat out wrong that most Jewish Israeli's live 'secular lives.' It's a common misconception - but the most comprehensive survey done on the matter that I could find (http://www.jcpa.org/dje/articles2/relinisr-consensus.htm http://www.jcpa.org/dje/articles2/relinisr-consensus.htm) says otherwise. About 20% of Jews in Israel identify themselves as secular - but most of those aren't secular for all intents and purposes (they attend temple, perform rituals, believe in God, etc). Over half the Jews in Israel believe that the Jewish people were 'chosen' among other people by God. A substantial minority (more than are actually secular) believe that non-practicing Jews are a threat to the Jewish people! So, that is where I get the idea that they don't question religion.

thelonecabbage 17y ago
Again it's a question of definitions. Israelis define "religious" differently. About 20-30% of Israelis are what Americans would consider "religious", about a 1/3 of that is "ultra-religious". The 20% that consider themselves "secular", REALY mean secular. As in, hard-core-athiest. They eat pork, and it's not a statement, it's just meat. You'd love them. To clarify what lies between let me explain. In a recent survey some 75% of Israelis claimed to keep some form of kosher. For the majority of that sample space "kosher" meant lobster but no pork. Both equally unkosher, but there is a stigma attached to pork. All the same, these same lobster-jews would be very offended if you called them non-religious, they are in their OWN WAY. In American definition they are "non-practicing", but not in their own. The "subsantial-minority" is a weasel word. But is largely limited to what would be termed "ultra-religious", and they are entitled to their opinion, thats a democracy for you. Last I checked, there was a substantial-minority in the US that considered seculars dangerous, their called the religious right. Either way, this has NOTHING to do with startups. Israelis, like anyone else, are complex people. Up close, Israelis are hard working, an incredible combination of the empathic and the aggressive. Some are good some are bad, most are a bit of both. And speaking as a religious person, everyone questions their faith, and even more their "religion". I don't know anyone who is that simple. Don't turn people into caricature.

by smanek 17y ago

thelonecabbage 17y ago

Again it's a question of definitions. Israelis define "religious" differently. About 20-30% of Israelis are what Americans would consider "religious", about a 1/3 of that is "ultra-religious". The 20% that consider themselves "secular", REALY mean secular. As in, hard-core-athiest. They eat pork, and it's not a statement, it's just meat. You'd love them. To clarify what lies between let me explain. In a recent survey some 75% of Israelis claimed to keep some form of kosher. For the majority of that sample space "kosher" meant lobster but no pork. Both equally unkosher, but there is a stigma attached to pork. All the same, these same lobster-jews would be very offended if you called them non-religious, they are in their OWN WAY. In American definition they are "non-practicing", but not in their own. The "subsantial-minority" is a weasel word. But is largely limited to what would be termed "ultra-religious", and they are entitled to their opinion, thats a democracy for you. Last I checked, there was a substantial-minority in the US that considered seculars dangerous, their called the religious right. Either way, this has NOTHING to do with startups. Israelis, like anyone else, are complex people. Up close, Israelis are hard working, an incredible combination of the empathic and the aggressive. Some are good some are bad, most are a bit of both. And speaking as a religious person, everyone questions their faith, and even more their "religion". I don't know anyone who is that simple. Don't turn people into caricature.