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Why are so many companies hacking on atom recently? First it was MS, and now FB? Anything special about Atom that you don't get in something like Vim or Emacs?

Why are so many companies hacking on atom recently? First it was MS, and now FB? Anything special about Atom that you don't get in something like Vim or Emacs? They're both open source, and very hackable.

wnevets 11y ago
its basically an open source sublime and a lot of people like sublimes UI and plugins.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
vbezhenar 11y ago
I remember Eclipse being forked a lot by various enterprise companies. I guess that's because it had very good extensible architecture. Many developers admitted it. May be Atom is in similar position? Today's fashion shifted from Java to JavaScript and tools are following.
- mateuszf 11y ago
  Vim and especially Emacs are also very good at providing extension points.
Nelkins 11y ago
It's much easier to provide a cross-platform rich UI experience with Electron/Atom. It's probably also easier to leverage existing developer skill sets (HTML, JS, CSS, etc.)
spicyj 11y ago
Not quite an equal comparison: Visual Studio Code uses only the very core of Atom which allows you to package a browser-based app in a native shell (sort of like Cordova/PhoneGap). Nuclide actually uses the entire Atom editor.
x5n1 11y ago
It's okay hopefully all this gets merged into atom when these projects don't get the userbase they are looking for.
- empyrical 11y ago
  They said they'd like to make this stuff work as Atom plugins eventually
  - git-fucked 11y ago
    I think they say in the video that they were developing them as Atom plugins from the outset - i.e. Nuclide isn't a piece of software on its own, Nuclide IS Atom.
    - empyrical 11y ago
      Yep, you're right - you install Nuclide by using Atom's package manager http://nuclide.io/docs/setup/ http://nuclide.io/docs/setup/
superuser2 11y ago
Yes, a native-feeling GUI. Emacs GUI for OSX is ugly and unpolished. Atom's real competition is Sublime, but unlike Sublime it's open source.
- magicmu 11y ago
  I agree; with vim as well, gVim isn't much help to those who still want to use a mouse / don't know the keybindings. Atom is really the most versatile open-source GUI text editor right now IMO.
  - xienze 11y ago
    Well, I think the OP's point is that it would be easier to bring Emacs/VIM up to acceptable GUI editor standards rather than build the whole thing from scratch, as a webapp no less. But they didn't, my guess is because NIH.
    - grmarcil 11y ago
      Keep in mind, Atom was NIH at Facebook too.
    - coldtea 11y ago
      >is that it would be easier to bring Emacs/VIM up to acceptable GUI editor standards Perhaps but nobody has done it yet.
      - oblio 11y ago
        And it's not for lack of trying. The last major attempt was Sun Studio on the 90's/early 00's. Emacs and Vim are like Lisp at this point: unicorns. Perfect, mythical creatures everybody loves to talk about. Meanwhile oxen like Eclipse, Visual Studio, Sublime, etc. keep chugging 90% of the world's code :)
    - Blackthorn 11y ago
      > Well, I think the OP's point is that it would be easier to bring Emacs/VIM up to acceptable GUI editor standards I've been waiting for this for literally a decade with emacs. It hasn't happened and I don't have the expertise to do it, so nowadays I exclusively use IntelliJ for the languages I can. I'm probably going to start using CLion with it as well. There are lots of aspects of Emacs that I miss but I hope that IntelliJ can take them over with future iterations of the vestigial "IDE scripting console". They just need to put a lispy language in there like Clojure and bindings into the editor like Emacs Lisp has.
afarrell 11y ago
javascript is a much more debuggable language than vimscript and there is far better tool support for it.
coldtea 11y ago
>Anything special about Atom that you don't get in something like Vim or Emacs? A majority of programmers actually wanting to use it. While we might use Emacs and Vim in our echo chamber, the huge masses of programmers prefer an IDE or something like TextMate, SublimeText, Notepad++ etc.
- markbnj 11y ago
  The speaker was explicit about FB's preference for IDEs and IDE features, and their belief that these features make them more productive. So in that respect their internal majority has already spoken.
techpeace 11y ago
Atom is a graphical editor, unlike either Vim or Emacs. It's much easier for web developers specifically to work on, since it's built with web technologies, rather than vimscript. If I want to change the background color of the file browser pane, I can pop open an inspector, identify the element, and change my custom editor CSS, all within about 2 minutes. Its plugin distribution system also integrates directly into the editor - meaning I can browse for and install plugins from within the Atom itself.

wnevets 11y ago

its basically an open source sublime and a lot of people like sublimes UI and plugins.

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

vbezhenar 11y ago

I remember Eclipse being forked a lot by various enterprise companies. I guess that's because it had very good extensible architecture. Many developers admitted it. May be Atom is in similar position? Today's fashion shifted from Java to JavaScript and tools are following.

mateuszf 11y ago
Vim and especially Emacs are also very good at providing extension points.

Nelkins 11y ago

It's much easier to provide a cross-platform rich UI experience with Electron/Atom. It's probably also easier to leverage existing developer skill sets (HTML, JS, CSS, etc.)

spicyj 11y ago

Not quite an equal comparison: Visual Studio Code uses only the very core of Atom which allows you to package a browser-based app in a native shell (sort of like Cordova/PhoneGap). Nuclide actually uses the entire Atom editor.

x5n1 11y ago

It's okay hopefully all this gets merged into atom when these projects don't get the userbase they are looking for.

empyrical 11y ago
They said they'd like to make this stuff work as Atom plugins eventually
- git-fucked 11y ago
  I think they say in the video that they were developing them as Atom plugins from the outset - i.e. Nuclide isn't a piece of software on its own, Nuclide IS Atom.
  - empyrical 11y ago
    Yep, you're right - you install Nuclide by using Atom's package manager http://nuclide.io/docs/setup/ http://nuclide.io/docs/setup/

superuser2 11y ago

Yes, a native-feeling GUI. Emacs GUI for OSX is ugly and unpolished. Atom's real competition is Sublime, but unlike Sublime it's open source.

magicmu 11y ago
I agree; with vim as well, gVim isn't much help to those who still want to use a mouse / don't know the keybindings. Atom is really the most versatile open-source GUI text editor right now IMO.
- xienze 11y ago
  Well, I think the OP's point is that it would be easier to bring Emacs/VIM up to acceptable GUI editor standards rather than build the whole thing from scratch, as a webapp no less. But they didn't, my guess is because NIH.
  - grmarcil 11y ago
    Keep in mind, Atom was NIH at Facebook too.
  - coldtea 11y ago
    >is that it would be easier to bring Emacs/VIM up to acceptable GUI editor standards Perhaps but nobody has done it yet.
    - oblio 11y ago
      And it's not for lack of trying. The last major attempt was Sun Studio on the 90's/early 00's. Emacs and Vim are like Lisp at this point: unicorns. Perfect, mythical creatures everybody loves to talk about. Meanwhile oxen like Eclipse, Visual Studio, Sublime, etc. keep chugging 90% of the world's code :)
  - Blackthorn 11y ago
    > Well, I think the OP's point is that it would be easier to bring Emacs/VIM up to acceptable GUI editor standards I've been waiting for this for literally a decade with emacs. It hasn't happened and I don't have the expertise to do it, so nowadays I exclusively use IntelliJ for the languages I can. I'm probably going to start using CLion with it as well. There are lots of aspects of Emacs that I miss but I hope that IntelliJ can take them over with future iterations of the vestigial "IDE scripting console". They just need to put a lispy language in there like Clojure and bindings into the editor like Emacs Lisp has.

afarrell 11y ago

javascript is a much more debuggable language than vimscript and there is far better tool support for it.

coldtea 11y ago

>Anything special about Atom that you don't get in something like Vim or Emacs? A majority of programmers actually wanting to use it. While we might use Emacs and Vim in our echo chamber, the huge masses of programmers prefer an IDE or something like TextMate, SublimeText, Notepad++ etc.

markbnj 11y ago
The speaker was explicit about FB's preference for IDEs and IDE features, and their belief that these features make them more productive. So in that respect their internal majority has already spoken.

techpeace 11y ago

Atom is a graphical editor, unlike either Vim or Emacs. It's much easier for web developers specifically to work on, since it's built with web technologies, rather than vimscript. If I want to change the background color of the file browser pane, I can pop open an inspector, identify the element, and change my custom editor CSS, all within about 2 minutes. Its plugin distribution system also integrates directly into the editor - meaning I can browse for and install plugins from within the Atom itself.