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As opposed to Obama, who had absolutely zero track record?

by fixxer 11y ago

veidr 11y ago
No, as opposed to most political candidates who have historically been taken seriously as candidates for the presidency. Obama was (and is) an outlier.
- kevin_thibedeau 11y ago
  It's worth noting that Obama himself was not originally planning to run in 2008 due to lack of experience in public office. Tom Daschle is responsible for pushing him to run precisely because he had no track record on hot topic issues that weakened the competition.
  - veidr 11y ago
    Yeah, I totally agree that is worth noting -- I think until Obama beat Clinton in some of the early contests, the conventional wisdom from virtually everybody (who follows politics) was that it was just too early for him to go for the big prize. But I am curious whether that will hold -- whether candidates like Obama will remain outliers -- or whether that kind of thing will become the new normal. Our political system is somewhat sick; having any record is a political liability. That is why our politicians almost all speak in tongues incomprehensible to any normal human being. But the people favoring the established/experienced candidates are mainly the ones engaged and participating in the system which (perhaps insanely) doesn't include 98% of voters. So I wouldn't be that surprised if candidates with very limited experience in government become more common.
repsilat 11y ago
Joelrunyon's top comment was a straw-man -- nobody said "paying your dues" was a sufficient condition -- so it seems fitting that the next snarky post down the thread would sarcastically attack the idea that it's a necessary condition. When gjm11 said "justifying" they obviously meant "supporting". And yeah, after Obama's train-wreck foreign policy and complete disconnect with legislators on both sides of the aisle, it's pretty reasonable to highlight your experience as a positive quality.
- joelrunyon 11y ago
  It wasn't a straw man. I have no public opinion on Hillary as a candidate. I have a problem with arguments being made about candidates in the manner that the article made them.

As opposed to Obama, who had absolutely zero track record?

by fixxer 11y ago

As opposed to Obama, who had absolutely zero track record?

veidr 11y ago

No, as opposed to most political candidates who have historically been taken seriously as candidates for the presidency. Obama was (and is) an outlier.

kevin_thibedeau 11y ago
It's worth noting that Obama himself was not originally planning to run in 2008 due to lack of experience in public office. Tom Daschle is responsible for pushing him to run precisely because he had no track record on hot topic issues that weakened the competition.
- veidr 11y ago
  Yeah, I totally agree that is worth noting -- I think until Obama beat Clinton in some of the early contests, the conventional wisdom from virtually everybody (who follows politics) was that it was just too early for him to go for the big prize. But I am curious whether that will hold -- whether candidates like Obama will remain outliers -- or whether that kind of thing will become the new normal. Our political system is somewhat sick; having any record is a political liability. That is why our politicians almost all speak in tongues incomprehensible to any normal human being. But the people favoring the established/experienced candidates are mainly the ones engaged and participating in the system which (perhaps insanely) doesn't include 98% of voters. So I wouldn't be that surprised if candidates with very limited experience in government become more common.

repsilat 11y ago

Joelrunyon's top comment was a straw-man -- nobody said "paying your dues" was a sufficient condition -- so it seems fitting that the next snarky post down the thread would sarcastically attack the idea that it's a necessary condition. When gjm11 said "justifying" they obviously meant "supporting". And yeah, after Obama's train-wreck foreign policy and complete disconnect with legislators on both sides of the aisle, it's pretty reasonable to highlight your experience as a positive quality.

joelrunyon 11y ago
It wasn't a straw man. I have no public opinion on Hillary as a candidate. I have a problem with arguments being made about candidates in the manner that the article made them.