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> Imagine that swift becomes a super dominant language both for client and server, but that half of the ecosystem still remains locked by Apple Isn't that exac

> Imagine that swift becomes a super dominant language both for client and server, but that half of the ecosystem still remains locked by Apple Isn't that exactly the situation with C# and .net? C# is kinda open source but the runtime is completely Microsoft's. Nobody seems to make a big deal of it, and C# developers seem pretty happy with their platform overall.

bsaul 11y ago
I wouldn't call C# a super dominant language. it is extremely popular in the corporate world, where paying for something is seen as a good thing, because it means you've got support from a vendor. In the start up culture, where technological innovation and taking risks are core values, people tend to favor maximum freedom and maximum technological possibilities, which are often in contradiction with what a corporation would like you to do. Now that corporations want to have the same level of innovation you usually find in start ups, they start to want to use the same tools and embrace a bit of its culture. Note that Microsoft saw that and have announced massive open sourcing of every part of the .Net ecosystem just this year (which made a big impression here on HN, judging by the comments). And now we've got Apple and swift, and people start to wonder if it's going to be "Ballmer" open sourcing, "Nadella" open sourcing, or "Stallman" open sourcing. It's not just a matter of ideology. It will have practical consequences on the possibilities of using the language on every server configuration, of building innovative software with it, things even people at Apple wouldn't anticipate. Or if you're going to remain constrained to where Apple wants to allow this technology to grow.
- outworlder 11y ago
  Not just corporate, don't forget that Mono exists. And things like Unity include it, which means a lot of games are written in C#.
  - emodendroket 11y ago
    It exists but it's also tiny and poorly-supported compared to the Microsoft implementation.
pbz 11y ago
That's no longer the case; the runtime is now open source too.
hobarrera 11y ago
- C# did not become super dominant. - The runtime was only recently open sources, and MS keeps on releasing more bits. Their goal is to clearly port the entire runtime to OS X and Linux.
mattmanser 11y ago
No, it's not any more. http://blogs.msdn.com/b/dotnet/archive/2014/11/12/net-core-is-open-source.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/dotnet/archive/2014/11/12/net-core-i...

bsaul 11y ago

I wouldn't call C# a super dominant language. it is extremely popular in the corporate world, where paying for something is seen as a good thing, because it means you've got support from a vendor. In the start up culture, where technological innovation and taking risks are core values, people tend to favor maximum freedom and maximum technological possibilities, which are often in contradiction with what a corporation would like you to do. Now that corporations want to have the same level of innovation you usually find in start ups, they start to want to use the same tools and embrace a bit of its culture. Note that Microsoft saw that and have announced massive open sourcing of every part of the .Net ecosystem just this year (which made a big impression here on HN, judging by the comments). And now we've got Apple and swift, and people start to wonder if it's going to be "Ballmer" open sourcing, "Nadella" open sourcing, or "Stallman" open sourcing. It's not just a matter of ideology. It will have practical consequences on the possibilities of using the language on every server configuration, of building innovative software with it, things even people at Apple wouldn't anticipate. Or if you're going to remain constrained to where Apple wants to allow this technology to grow.

outworlder 11y ago
Not just corporate, don't forget that Mono exists. And things like Unity include it, which means a lot of games are written in C#.
- emodendroket 11y ago
  It exists but it's also tiny and poorly-supported compared to the Microsoft implementation.

pbz 11y ago

That's no longer the case; the runtime is now open source too.

hobarrera 11y ago

- C# did not become super dominant. - The runtime was only recently open sources, and MS keeps on releasing more bits. Their goal is to clearly port the entire runtime to OS X and Linux.

mattmanser 11y ago

No, it's not any more. http://blogs.msdn.com/b/dotnet/archive/2014/11/12/net-core-is-open-source.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/dotnet/archive/2014/11/12/net-core-i...