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I strongly doubt it. Singapore has interesting leadership that isn't afraid to be controversial, but engineer salaries there are terrible. A senior engineer in

I strongly doubt it. Singapore has interesting leadership that isn't afraid to be controversial, but engineer salaries there are terrible. A senior engineer in Singapore makes $47,000 according to Glassdoor (compare: $95k Chicago, $113k NYC, $38k Budapest, $67k Berlin, and $124k San Francisco). Chicago probably has the best salary/cost-of-living ratio and Budapest isn't so bad because it's cheap. Singapore, on the other hand, has NYC-level rents if you can't get into high-density housing. It's not great for software engineers (compared to executives) anywhere but, at least in the other cities I listed, there's a fighting chance of them getting something beyond a college lifestyle. If you don't have at least some engineers making money and getting to call shots-- I'll argue till I'm blue in the face that the current Valley culture doesn't have enough of them, but it has some-- then you don't get innovation. You get the same tired old ideas, sped along just slightly by a higher degree of technical efficiency (the rising tide). I'd love to be wrong about this, but I've interviewed with a couple of Singapore companies in my life and the culture that I've seen is just not progressive nor is it pro-technologist. It seems to still be a world where businessmen call the shots-- but I'll admit: I don't live there. Given that it was difficult to get anyone but a bank to pay for relocation (I became "cat relo guy", for one place, because I mentioned that it'd cost $7k to move my cats... that negotiation, predictably, fell through) I'm pretty sure I never will.

hitekker 11y ago
I'm the son of a Singaporean immigrant and have been to Singapore several times, including a 5-6 month period of actually living there: I must say that I can't agree more with your assessment. From ministers declaring programming to be (paraphrasing) a "tradeable" skill, to Universities placing Computer Science as just a part of Computer Engineering (i.e. the hardware is more important the software), I'd say that Software Engineers are very much looked down upon. Another problem with Singaporean Tech is that, besides the low wages and the unsupportive culture, is that Singapore is too small a market for any startup there to achieve local success. The kind of scale companies can reach in the US alone is impossible on the island: 100% penetration of Singapore is equivalent to 2% in the US.
- WoMaameTwe 11y ago
  My sentiments exactly. 100% Singaporean penetration is hard enough. But sucking a corporate dick for a pittance is also hard enough. Its an exploiters market
heyheyhey 11y ago
> I became "cat relo guy", for one place, because I mentioned that it'd cost $7k to move my cats... that negotiation, predictably, fell through How many cats do you have and why did it cost so much?
- bduerst 11y ago
  I'm not them, but flying with animals is incredibly expensive, even after you cover the vet reqs for the country. Cats are much harder than dogs to get through customs, because cats can carry more communicable diseases.
- michaelochurch 11y ago
  2 cats. Singapore has mandatory quarantine and that, along with transportation, is expensive.
ValentineC 11y ago
> I strongly doubt it. Singapore has interesting leadership that isn't afraid to be controversial, but engineer salaries there are terrible. A senior engineer in Singapore makes $47,000 according to Glassdoor (compare: $95k Chicago, $113k NYC, $38k Budapest, $67k Berlin, and $124k San Francisco). Singaporean here. I know of junior engineer peers with salaries ranging from $36k USD (the minimum for a graduate to get a work visa) to $58k USD. Salaries tend to be benchmarked against the public sector, where graduates can expect to start from $36k USD or less, before bonuses. [1] They're also arguably depressed by strong competition from Indonesia, Vietnam, and the Philippines. While salaries aren't great, the Asian family tradition remains strong — people live with their parents until they're either married, or hit 35 and become eligible to purchase a public apartment. One advantage of working in Singapore is that income tax rates are low. [2] Most peers I know pay between 5–10% of their income in tax. All that said, I know of senior engineers earning >$130k salaries (as compared to the $47k on Glassdoor). There's a huge variance in the market. [1] http://www.straitstimes.com/news/singapore/education/story/higher-median-pay-fresh-grads-last-year-survey-20150228 http://www.straitstimes.com/news/singapore/education/story/h... [2] http://www.guidemesingapore.com/taxation/personal-tax/singapore-personal-tax-guide http://www.guidemesingapore.com/taxation/personal-tax/singap...

hitekker 11y ago

I'm the son of a Singaporean immigrant and have been to Singapore several times, including a 5-6 month period of actually living there: I must say that I can't agree more with your assessment. From ministers declaring programming to be (paraphrasing) a "tradeable" skill, to Universities placing Computer Science as just a part of Computer Engineering (i.e. the hardware is more important the software), I'd say that Software Engineers are very much looked down upon. Another problem with Singaporean Tech is that, besides the low wages and the unsupportive culture, is that Singapore is too small a market for any startup there to achieve local success. The kind of scale companies can reach in the US alone is impossible on the island: 100% penetration of Singapore is equivalent to 2% in the US.

WoMaameTwe 11y ago
My sentiments exactly. 100% Singaporean penetration is hard enough. But sucking a corporate dick for a pittance is also hard enough. Its an exploiters market

heyheyhey 11y ago

> I became "cat relo guy", for one place, because I mentioned that it'd cost $7k to move my cats... that negotiation, predictably, fell through How many cats do you have and why did it cost so much?

bduerst 11y ago
I'm not them, but flying with animals is incredibly expensive, even after you cover the vet reqs for the country. Cats are much harder than dogs to get through customs, because cats can carry more communicable diseases.
michaelochurch 11y ago
2 cats. Singapore has mandatory quarantine and that, along with transportation, is expensive.

ValentineC 11y ago

> I strongly doubt it. Singapore has interesting leadership that isn't afraid to be controversial, but engineer salaries there are terrible. A senior engineer in Singapore makes $47,000 according to Glassdoor (compare: $95k Chicago, $113k NYC, $38k Budapest, $67k Berlin, and $124k San Francisco). Singaporean here. I know of junior engineer peers with salaries ranging from $36k USD (the minimum for a graduate to get a work visa) to $58k USD. Salaries tend to be benchmarked against the public sector, where graduates can expect to start from $36k USD or less, before bonuses. [1] They're also arguably depressed by strong competition from Indonesia, Vietnam, and the Philippines. While salaries aren't great, the Asian family tradition remains strong — people live with their parents until they're either married, or hit 35 and become eligible to purchase a public apartment. One advantage of working in Singapore is that income tax rates are low. [2] Most peers I know pay between 5–10% of their income in tax. All that said, I know of senior engineers earning >$130k salaries (as compared to the $47k on Glassdoor). There's a huge variance in the market. [1] http://www.straitstimes.com/news/singapore/education/story/higher-median-pay-fresh-grads-last-year-survey-20150228 http://www.straitstimes.com/news/singapore/education/story/h... [2] http://www.guidemesingapore.com/taxation/personal-tax/singapore-personal-tax-guide http://www.guidemesingapore.com/taxation/personal-tax/singap...