3 ms·

This is interesting.. I was reading this cool thread a couple of days ago (some really useful stuff): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5965081 https://news

This is interesting.. I was reading this cool thread a couple of days ago (some really useful stuff): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5965081 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5965081 and stumbled across your comment. I thought it was neat (I'm using -not- TransOver for the moment). Here's what I can think of, off the top of my head, but first some background: I'm acquiring Spanish right now and simultaneously scratching the surface of German, Russian, Hebrew, and Persian. They have a lower priority, but I'm making progress. As you may have noticed, English is not my first language. I learned it out of necessity (resources I needed were in English). I read a lot, and in the beginning, my head hurt as I read stuff written in English. I had MediaDico on my computer to translate from English to French. I struggled with idioms (I needed to read several examples of an idiom to get the gist of it)... But I can pin-point the exact moment where my learning was about to soar: I was in the living room and I decided that my computer experience had to shift to English. This means that even when I was to search for stuff, I'd do it in English. My brain bled. Something trivial to search for in a language I knew, something I already had the keywords ready, not in my mind but in my fingertips, to search Google for, would take me way longer to think about, formulate, and come up with keywords for, in English. What would be cool is this: - A user doesn't have to click on on a word to translate it. The extension makes a sort of histogram of the most used words or expressions (a frequency list of the page), and automatically translates them. Since they're the most used words or expressions on the page, the person will be exposed to them often: "accidentally on purpose" rote repetition. This will be useful for the next step: - The extension _remembers_ (keeps a list of) which words (should) already have been learned by the user (which words he has been exposed to the most), and in subsequent pages will display them in the target language without the user doing anything. They will no longer be displayed in the user's language. - The first message it displayed was that I had to drag some link, etc.. Why is that? - I had a message saying "This is a very large page". Maybe the extension can translate stuff the user is most likely to see first, and as the user browses, it does stuff.. Think Python generators. All my best !

steveridout 11y ago
Hmm, sorry if I'm misunderstanding, but from your suggestions it's not clear if you realise that the extension is intended for reading in your target language and translating occasional words to your native language. e.g. > ...and in subsequent pages will display them in the target language without the user doing anything. They will no longer be displayed in the user's language. The idea is that to learn Spanish, you read Spanish webpages, so everything is displayed in the target language at first, and you click to get the English translation. Detecting words which are unusually frequent in the page you're reading, and automatically adding a translation to the first instance is a cool idea. > The first message it displayed was that I had to drag some link, etc.. Why is that? I think you're referring to the bookmarklet that needs to be installed to translate webpages, this is an alternative to the Chrome extension and works on almost all browsers. > I had a message saying "This is a very large page" Yeah, this is pretty ugly, should think of a nicer solution.
- Jugurtha 11y ago
  >Hmm, sorry if I'm misunderstanding, but from your suggestions it's not clear if you realise that the extension is intended for reading in your target language and translating occasional words to your native language. I think the idea is that to learn Spanish, you read not only Spanish webpages, but even the webpages you read that happen not to be in Spanish can become so. The way you intend your extension to work assumes the user is already on a Spanish webpage. This assumes the user has overcome procrastination and reads pages in his target language often. Now, as a language learner yourself: What percentage of all people who want to learn a language does that case represent? How many overcame procrastination and practice everyday? These are the users who don't need help and would be fine. The biggest problems in language learning are two: - Procrastination. - Weak, infrequent and/or sporadic exposure. Just imagine if in addition to catering to those serious users the way you do now, you can annihilate learners' worst problems and serve the whole 99% of people who've had "I want to learn X" on their mind for 5+ years but have been too intimidated, or think it's too hard.. They're on a page in English sprinkled with foreign words in context. They get value with every single page they read. If they don't understand a word, the only effort they make is click on it. If they somehow read a sign in the streets or see something in TV in the target language and they recognize it, they will have a smile and that will be a turning point. This is where they'll feel "It works". It has more significance because they've tried to learn that language years ago with a bunch of arcane methods, and weren't even able to do the smallest things with it. Discomfort threshold to the prospect of reading pages in the target language is decreased by the page. Your extension isn't one that translates words on a webpage, it is as an extension that minimizes friction to learn a langue. It can do it in a variety of ways and already does a great job with the flash-cards. Everybody hates doing the legwork and you're getting them to "Read it and it gets saved". >I think you're referring to the bookmarklet that needs to be installed to translate webpages, this is an alternative to the Chrome extension and works on almost all browsers. It's just a guess, but I think a lot of people would benefit if this step gets streamlined. It's already cool that it doesn't require restarting the browser, and making it even more seamless would be awesome. A user has only to click on the install button on the Chrome extensions pages and that's it. No further intervention. This is for more accessibility. There a lot of people who don't know what a bookmark is, or bookmarklet for that matter. All the best,

steveridout 11y ago

Hmm, sorry if I'm misunderstanding, but from your suggestions it's not clear if you realise that the extension is intended for reading in your target language and translating occasional words to your native language. e.g. > ...and in subsequent pages will display them in the target language without the user doing anything. They will no longer be displayed in the user's language. The idea is that to learn Spanish, you read Spanish webpages, so everything is displayed in the target language at first, and you click to get the English translation. Detecting words which are unusually frequent in the page you're reading, and automatically adding a translation to the first instance is a cool idea. > The first message it displayed was that I had to drag some link, etc.. Why is that? I think you're referring to the bookmarklet that needs to be installed to translate webpages, this is an alternative to the Chrome extension and works on almost all browsers. > I had a message saying "This is a very large page" Yeah, this is pretty ugly, should think of a nicer solution.

Jugurtha 11y ago
>Hmm, sorry if I'm misunderstanding, but from your suggestions it's not clear if you realise that the extension is intended for reading in your target language and translating occasional words to your native language. I think the idea is that to learn Spanish, you read not only Spanish webpages, but even the webpages you read that happen not to be in Spanish can become so. The way you intend your extension to work assumes the user is already on a Spanish webpage. This assumes the user has overcome procrastination and reads pages in his target language often. Now, as a language learner yourself: What percentage of all people who want to learn a language does that case represent? How many overcame procrastination and practice everyday? These are the users who don't need help and would be fine. The biggest problems in language learning are two: - Procrastination. - Weak, infrequent and/or sporadic exposure. Just imagine if in addition to catering to those serious users the way you do now, you can annihilate learners' worst problems and serve the whole 99% of people who've had "I want to learn X" on their mind for 5+ years but have been too intimidated, or think it's too hard.. They're on a page in English sprinkled with foreign words in context. They get value with every single page they read. If they don't understand a word, the only effort they make is click on it. If they somehow read a sign in the streets or see something in TV in the target language and they recognize it, they will have a smile and that will be a turning point. This is where they'll feel "It works". It has more significance because they've tried to learn that language years ago with a bunch of arcane methods, and weren't even able to do the smallest things with it. Discomfort threshold to the prospect of reading pages in the target language is decreased by the page. Your extension isn't one that translates words on a webpage, it is as an extension that minimizes friction to learn a langue. It can do it in a variety of ways and already does a great job with the flash-cards. Everybody hates doing the legwork and you're getting them to "Read it and it gets saved". >I think you're referring to the bookmarklet that needs to be installed to translate webpages, this is an alternative to the Chrome extension and works on almost all browsers. It's just a guess, but I think a lot of people would benefit if this step gets streamlined. It's already cool that it doesn't require restarting the browser, and making it even more seamless would be awesome. A user has only to click on the install button on the Chrome extensions pages and that's it. No further intervention. This is for more accessibility. There a lot of people who don't know what a bookmark is, or bookmarklet for that matter. All the best,