3 ms·

Shouldn't programmers be polyglot by default. It's like saying there is a conference for golfers who play with more than one club!

dagw 11y ago
Programmers should obviously be polyglots to some extent, but the question here is if conferences should be. Basically do you want 14 high level introductions to 14 different languages or 14 presentations digging deeper and deeper in to one specific language? I can certainly see advantages to both. I'm sure even your golfer might be interested in attending a masterclass that only covered putting.
- aaggarwal 11y ago
  Good point. A conference where different challenges are solved with different programming languages and the people can present their results and conclude the advantages of a certain language for a certain challenge. I believe this always existed in tech world, but, its good that it is getting formalized as a conference. Maybe it could turn out to be like a programming language expo :)
fragmede 11y ago
Only if you think of programming languages as an individual golf-club. Put it this way: Is there a conference for professional basketball, baseball AND ice hockey players? I'm not even aware of anyone who managed to go pro in two of those, not to mention all three. Most programmers have a preferred domain and language. Once you scale past a pet project and have a decently sized team, specializations start to occur, especially as the code base grows beyond what one person can hold in memory. I'm reminded of the saying "jack of all trades, master of none".
- bshimmin 11y ago
  Did Michael Jordan count as a professional basketball and baseball player?
- lbhnact 11y ago
  Felt the need to remind you whippersnappers about Bo Jackson! I'd also argue that the skills needed for multilanguage competency as a programmer aren't as mutually exclusive as some of the physical traits needed for pro-level athletic talent. [1]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Jackson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Jackson [2]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_multi-sport_athletes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_multi-sport_athletes
- dagw 11y ago
  I'm not even aware of anyone who managed to go pro in two of those There are a handful of athletes that have played both pro football and baseball, Bo Jackson probably being the most famous. Michael Jordan played pro Baseball and Basketball, but was never a good baseball player
  - dragonwriter 11y ago
    > There are a handful of athletes that have played both pro football and baseball Well, a particularly large hand: If you are even narrower than "pro" and restrict it to just MLB and NFL, there are several dozen [0] [0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_athletes_who_played_in_Major_League_Baseball_and_the_National_Football_League http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_athletes_who_played_in_...
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- noir-york 11y ago
  You're kidding right? A programming language is another tech tool in the box. Just like using git, a debugger, Linux, nginx, etc. Do you have different people in your team: one focused on nginx, one on bash, one on Python, one on PHP, and one on algo design? > Most programmers have a preferred domain and language. A preferred domain perhaps. But a preferred language? That smells of sticking to one's (tightly drawn) comfort zone.
  - Retra 11y ago
    Preferences are usually a matter of personal opinion. They don't actually need to be justified. I prefer to speak English. Yes, "language is arbitrary", but pointing that out is kind of missing the point, isn't it?
- bitcrusher 11y ago
  Bo Jackson was both an NFL and MLB player. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Jackson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Jackson
  - jghn 11y ago
    As was Deion Sanders, but the GP didn't give football as one of his sports
- notNow 11y ago
  I'm not even aware of anyone who managed to go pro in two of those Not to discredit your argument even a bit, but Michael Jordan (MJ23) had a short stunt with pro baseball away from basketball. That was so easy man :)
- cafard 11y ago
  Somebody has already mentioned Bo Jackson. There was also Deion Sanders (at least I think he made into MLB briefly), and long before either Dave DeBusschere, who pitched a season or two in the big leagues and then had a good career in the NBA.
- dragonwriter 11y ago
  > Only if you think of programming languages as an individual golf-club. Which is a more accurate analogy than a whole sport. > Put it this way: Is there a conference for professional basketball, baseball AND ice hockey players? I'm not even aware of anyone who managed to go pro in two of those, not to mention all three. Among athletes that have gone pro in more than one sport, baseball/basketball seems to be a not-unusual combination: Michael Jordan is probably the best known example, but also Danny Ainge, Scott Burrell, Nathaniel Clifton, Dave Dubusschere, Cotton Nash, and Bill Sharman. Hockey is a pretty rare combination with either baseball or basketball.
- jerf 11y ago
  "Jack of all trades, master of none" applies to situations where the trades are not terribly related to each other. Beyond a certain basic level of knowledge that applies to everything, being a good plumber isn't going to contribute to your being a good farmer, which won't contribute to your being a good therapist. To be sorta good at all those things and others besides requires that you can not have put in the time to master any of them. Programming languages are different. For one, they all run on the same hardware. For another, the basics of logic and such are the same. And for the coup de grace, we have the well-known acecdata that learning a language of a significantly different paradigm than your "main" language generally improves your ability to program in your "main" language, to the point where I and others routinely recommend to people that they learn (or implement!) other language paradigms as a routine, expected part of their programming career. Learning Haskell to the point you can effectively use it can and will improve your PHP. In the programming field, I don't think you can be a master programmer without being a fairly effective polyglot, as a bare minimum requirement. That is, if someone claims to be a master but they only have fluency in one language, even if that language is C++ or something, I would not consider them a "programming" master, only a C++ master.
thirdtruck 11y ago
I think they should be (especially as a polyglot myself), but there's also a lot of pressure to super specialize, and not just from employers. Having a network of like-minded developers is an invaluable psychological and career resource.
pwojnowski 11y ago
Most of conferences for programmers are just around single language/technology so this one is something no so usual.

dagw 11y ago

Programmers should obviously be polyglots to some extent, but the question here is if conferences should be. Basically do you want 14 high level introductions to 14 different languages or 14 presentations digging deeper and deeper in to one specific language? I can certainly see advantages to both. I'm sure even your golfer might be interested in attending a masterclass that only covered putting.

aaggarwal 11y ago
Good point. A conference where different challenges are solved with different programming languages and the people can present their results and conclude the advantages of a certain language for a certain challenge. I believe this always existed in tech world, but, its good that it is getting formalized as a conference. Maybe it could turn out to be like a programming language expo :)

fragmede 11y ago

Only if you think of programming languages as an individual golf-club. Put it this way: Is there a conference for professional basketball, baseball AND ice hockey players? I'm not even aware of anyone who managed to go pro in two of those, not to mention all three. Most programmers have a preferred domain and language. Once you scale past a pet project and have a decently sized team, specializations start to occur, especially as the code base grows beyond what one person can hold in memory. I'm reminded of the saying "jack of all trades, master of none".

bshimmin 11y ago
Did Michael Jordan count as a professional basketball and baseball player?
lbhnact 11y ago
Felt the need to remind you whippersnappers about Bo Jackson! I'd also argue that the skills needed for multilanguage competency as a programmer aren't as mutually exclusive as some of the physical traits needed for pro-level athletic talent. [1]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Jackson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Jackson [2]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_multi-sport_athletes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_multi-sport_athletes
dagw 11y ago
I'm not even aware of anyone who managed to go pro in two of those There are a handful of athletes that have played both pro football and baseball, Bo Jackson probably being the most famous. Michael Jordan played pro Baseball and Basketball, but was never a good baseball player
- dragonwriter 11y ago
  > There are a handful of athletes that have played both pro football and baseball Well, a particularly large hand: If you are even narrower than "pro" and restrict it to just MLB and NFL, there are several dozen [0] [0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_athletes_who_played_in_Major_League_Baseball_and_the_National_Football_League http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_athletes_who_played_in_...
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
noir-york 11y ago
You're kidding right? A programming language is another tech tool in the box. Just like using git, a debugger, Linux, nginx, etc. Do you have different people in your team: one focused on nginx, one on bash, one on Python, one on PHP, and one on algo design? > Most programmers have a preferred domain and language. A preferred domain perhaps. But a preferred language? That smells of sticking to one's (tightly drawn) comfort zone.
- Retra 11y ago
  Preferences are usually a matter of personal opinion. They don't actually need to be justified. I prefer to speak English. Yes, "language is arbitrary", but pointing that out is kind of missing the point, isn't it?
bitcrusher 11y ago
Bo Jackson was both an NFL and MLB player. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Jackson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Jackson
- jghn 11y ago
  As was Deion Sanders, but the GP didn't give football as one of his sports
notNow 11y ago
I'm not even aware of anyone who managed to go pro in two of those Not to discredit your argument even a bit, but Michael Jordan (MJ23) had a short stunt with pro baseball away from basketball. That was so easy man :)
cafard 11y ago
Somebody has already mentioned Bo Jackson. There was also Deion Sanders (at least I think he made into MLB briefly), and long before either Dave DeBusschere, who pitched a season or two in the big leagues and then had a good career in the NBA.
dragonwriter 11y ago
> Only if you think of programming languages as an individual golf-club. Which is a more accurate analogy than a whole sport. > Put it this way: Is there a conference for professional basketball, baseball AND ice hockey players? I'm not even aware of anyone who managed to go pro in two of those, not to mention all three. Among athletes that have gone pro in more than one sport, baseball/basketball seems to be a not-unusual combination: Michael Jordan is probably the best known example, but also Danny Ainge, Scott Burrell, Nathaniel Clifton, Dave Dubusschere, Cotton Nash, and Bill Sharman. Hockey is a pretty rare combination with either baseball or basketball.
jerf 11y ago
"Jack of all trades, master of none" applies to situations where the trades are not terribly related to each other. Beyond a certain basic level of knowledge that applies to everything, being a good plumber isn't going to contribute to your being a good farmer, which won't contribute to your being a good therapist. To be sorta good at all those things and others besides requires that you can not have put in the time to master any of them. Programming languages are different. For one, they all run on the same hardware. For another, the basics of logic and such are the same. And for the coup de grace, we have the well-known acecdata that learning a language of a significantly different paradigm than your "main" language generally improves your ability to program in your "main" language, to the point where I and others routinely recommend to people that they learn (or implement!) other language paradigms as a routine, expected part of their programming career. Learning Haskell to the point you can effectively use it can and will improve your PHP. In the programming field, I don't think you can be a master programmer without being a fairly effective polyglot, as a bare minimum requirement. That is, if someone claims to be a master but they only have fluency in one language, even if that language is C++ or something, I would not consider them a "programming" master, only a C++ master.

thirdtruck 11y ago

I think they should be (especially as a polyglot myself), but there's also a lot of pressure to super specialize, and not just from employers. Having a network of like-minded developers is an invaluable psychological and career resource.

pwojnowski 11y ago

Most of conferences for programmers are just around single language/technology so this one is something no so usual.