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I think you may have left with the wrong impression. If you ask Googlers or Xooglers alike, most agree that the people here are actually the best thing about Go

I think you may have left with the wrong impression. If you ask Googlers or Xooglers alike, most agree that the people here are actually the best thing about Google. Like anywhere else, there are some bad apples, but compared to most other places the people here are on average more talented, nicer human beings and more helpful. Certainly compared to your typical startup or other BigCo. In my nearly 3 years here, that is my experience as well. I've also spoken to many engineers who have left who lamented the quality of their fellow engineering talent at their supposedly 'hot' startup, compared to their former team at Google. Or having to deal with way more unprofessional (or crazy) management, prima-donna teammates, etc.

jowiar 11y ago
As far as my specific interviewers are concerned, I liked 7 of the 8 as individuals, which is great. What I didn't like was the company felt like a monoculture. Same schools, same majors, same pre-education background. Everybody looks the same, dresses the same, etc. The process, on the other hand. Ugh. I have zero respect for Google as a company after that. It starts with the standard phone screen/day-long onsite/hazing ritual. Then come phone calls with teams, and teams saying "yeah, we want you", and me saying "sure, sounds good". The recruiter basically said "time for the higher-ups to rubber stamp this, and here's the $$ to expect". Someone up the chain said "well, we're not so sure, let's haul him back here for another round of onsite interviews". Which I did, it went through the same process, and the response was "well, maybe not you for this role, but lets set you up with more teams". All of this finally goes through, and I get an offer. Then there's a negotiation that goes something like: Me: I'd like 4 weeks to think about it while a couple of other applications come back (keeping in mind they've dragged this on about 2 months longer than it needed to be). Google: You get 2. Me: I'm at a conference week #2, but I'll do what i can to get a decision to you Friday. <Fast forward to monday of week #2> Google: Have you made up your mind yet? Me: I'd like to look at my options, and I'll get back to you COB Friday Google: It's really important that we hear beginning of day Friday <Fast forward to wednesday> Google: Have you made up your mind yet? Me: No. One of the options I was looking at is now off the table. Google: So WTF are you waiting for. Me: The other options <Fast forward to Thursday> <Phone rings while I'm at the conference> Me: You can't pay me enough to deal with this. Maybe no individual involved is a prima-donna, but the ego showed by the company as a whole through the recruitment process is stunning. It felt like I was dealing with the star quarterback who never considered that when they asked someone on a date, they might get turned down.
- hartator 11y ago
  What was their wording for "WTF are you waiting for"? This story felt like abuse.
  - jowiar 11y ago
    The exact exchange: Google: "Just checking in to see if you have an update for me? Can we set a time to speak on Friday?" Me: "I decided to pass on [OTHER OPPORTUNITY]. I let my manager know about the offer last Thursday. I am out at a conference this week, and we're going to discuss options on Friday. Does end-of-the-day Friday work for you? 5? 6?" Google: "I need to speak to you in the morning on Friday. if you are passing up [OTHER OPPORTUNITY, misspelled] why are we waiting till Friday. Can we talk now?"
  - jowiar 11y ago
    Also, It's hard to say "abuse" with a straight face, when at the end of the line there's a serious payday involved. It's easy to say "let's make sure we get it right", when 6-figure checks are involved. It just felt... off, though. Like, it would have felt normal if it was 7 years ago, and I was straight out of school, and as a process to separate amongst the folks in a given CS class. As someone who has worked as an engineer, though? It was disconcerting. Writing 20 lines of code is very different than writing 20,000, and the process that: (1) selects for the best writers of 20 lines of code, while thoroughly ignoring the skills required to write 20,000. (2) is exhausting. Like, none of the questions were "difficult", per se, but it was a draining process. I know the grades I got probably got worse as the day went on, and it wasn't because the questions got harder. It was just a matter of "are we done here yet"? Anyway, I guess it was also surprising, b/c Google is relatively known for having "the best" hiring process, and it just felt flawed, arbitrary, hostile, and not quite designed right. Basically, it felt more like a hazing ritual that existed because "we went through it" than anything that pertained to building a good team.
- atarian 11y ago
  In my experience, this is standard HR pressure. Not saying every company is like this, but once I'm given an offer I expect HR to use any carrot or stick to get me to accept.
danielvinson 11y ago
In my experience pretty much everyone is excellent, apart from the lower level non-engineering managers. These tend to be grads from top schools who have zero previous work experience. I encountered at least three or four in my time at Google who were just out to prove themselves and get promotions and regularly threw their teams under the bus.
- sjg007 11y ago
  This is an antipattern in management and I would be surprised if they got promoted.
  - M8 11y ago
    Sundar Pinchai got promoted though.
- fishnchips 11y ago
  I've seen some teams that fully deserved the bus treatment.

jowiar 11y ago

As far as my specific interviewers are concerned, I liked 7 of the 8 as individuals, which is great. What I didn't like was the company felt like a monoculture. Same schools, same majors, same pre-education background. Everybody looks the same, dresses the same, etc. The process, on the other hand. Ugh. I have zero respect for Google as a company after that. It starts with the standard phone screen/day-long onsite/hazing ritual. Then come phone calls with teams, and teams saying "yeah, we want you", and me saying "sure, sounds good". The recruiter basically said "time for the higher-ups to rubber stamp this, and here's the $$ to expect". Someone up the chain said "well, we're not so sure, let's haul him back here for another round of onsite interviews". Which I did, it went through the same process, and the response was "well, maybe not you for this role, but lets set you up with more teams". All of this finally goes through, and I get an offer. Then there's a negotiation that goes something like: Me: I'd like 4 weeks to think about it while a couple of other applications come back (keeping in mind they've dragged this on about 2 months longer than it needed to be). Google: You get 2. Me: I'm at a conference week #2, but I'll do what i can to get a decision to you Friday. <Fast forward to monday of week #2> Google: Have you made up your mind yet? Me: I'd like to look at my options, and I'll get back to you COB Friday Google: It's really important that we hear beginning of day Friday <Fast forward to wednesday> Google: Have you made up your mind yet? Me: No. One of the options I was looking at is now off the table. Google: So WTF are you waiting for. Me: The other options <Fast forward to Thursday> <Phone rings while I'm at the conference> Me: You can't pay me enough to deal with this. Maybe no individual involved is a prima-donna, but the ego showed by the company as a whole through the recruitment process is stunning. It felt like I was dealing with the star quarterback who never considered that when they asked someone on a date, they might get turned down.

hartator 11y ago
What was their wording for "WTF are you waiting for"? This story felt like abuse.
- jowiar 11y ago
  The exact exchange: Google: "Just checking in to see if you have an update for me? Can we set a time to speak on Friday?" Me: "I decided to pass on [OTHER OPPORTUNITY]. I let my manager know about the offer last Thursday. I am out at a conference this week, and we're going to discuss options on Friday. Does end-of-the-day Friday work for you? 5? 6?" Google: "I need to speak to you in the morning on Friday. if you are passing up [OTHER OPPORTUNITY, misspelled] why are we waiting till Friday. Can we talk now?"
- jowiar 11y ago
  Also, It's hard to say "abuse" with a straight face, when at the end of the line there's a serious payday involved. It's easy to say "let's make sure we get it right", when 6-figure checks are involved. It just felt... off, though. Like, it would have felt normal if it was 7 years ago, and I was straight out of school, and as a process to separate amongst the folks in a given CS class. As someone who has worked as an engineer, though? It was disconcerting. Writing 20 lines of code is very different than writing 20,000, and the process that: (1) selects for the best writers of 20 lines of code, while thoroughly ignoring the skills required to write 20,000. (2) is exhausting. Like, none of the questions were "difficult", per se, but it was a draining process. I know the grades I got probably got worse as the day went on, and it wasn't because the questions got harder. It was just a matter of "are we done here yet"? Anyway, I guess it was also surprising, b/c Google is relatively known for having "the best" hiring process, and it just felt flawed, arbitrary, hostile, and not quite designed right. Basically, it felt more like a hazing ritual that existed because "we went through it" than anything that pertained to building a good team.
atarian 11y ago
In my experience, this is standard HR pressure. Not saying every company is like this, but once I'm given an offer I expect HR to use any carrot or stick to get me to accept.

danielvinson 11y ago

In my experience pretty much everyone is excellent, apart from the lower level non-engineering managers. These tend to be grads from top schools who have zero previous work experience. I encountered at least three or four in my time at Google who were just out to prove themselves and get promotions and regularly threw their teams under the bus.

sjg007 11y ago
This is an antipattern in management and I would be surprised if they got promoted.
- M8 11y ago
  Sundar Pinchai got promoted though.
fishnchips 11y ago
I've seen some teams that fully deserved the bus treatment.