4 ms·

SASS takes it way too far. CSS is for styling, it's not a programming language and it never should be.

chriseppstein 17y ago
That what CSS is, but that doesn't mean that's the only way to style a website. Use your imagination and stop accepting the constraints that have been placed on you by those who got here first.
- wvenable 17y ago
  Some constraints are good. If it's not for constraints, you'd have cats marrying dogs and so on. Putting programming logic in a stylesheet language is asking for more complexity, not less. I agree with the author. CSS is universal. SASS is entirely different language with far less "speakers" and far less support. It may be superior to CSS, but that's only part of the equation.
  - tptacek 17y ago
    x86 assembly language is similarly universal. Nobody writes in it.
    - wvenable 17y ago
      CSS is closer to C than x86 (and C is more universal) Are you going to say nobody writes in that, too? Edit: I meant universal in that everyone reads/writes it -- not that it's the lowest level. Yes, nobody writes x86 so it's not similarly universal. C is pretty universal. Even if you code in Java, C#, or PHP you've still got a lot of C heritage there.
      - tptacek 17y ago
        I have no idea what your point is. People write in Java, Ruby, Lisp, Javascript, and any of 50 other languages to avoid writing bare-metal C, too.
        wvenable 17y ago
        I'm not sure what your point is! Your original comment about x86 doesn't even make sense -- most people don't know x86 assembler! However, all web designers know CSS. Nearly all web developers know CSS. That's what makes it universal! It's not about how low-level it is. We recently had to fire a design team and are in the process of moving to a different team. If all the styles were in SASS, I'd have a much bigger problem. Even something like LessCSS has a much smaller learning curve because it looks like CSS. You can use it much more minimally (using only variables, for example) and get a small benefit with a small learning curve. Think of how many of those 50 other languages look like C.
        tptacek 17y ago
        It really seems like you don't understand how Sass works, or at least haven't actually run it. If anything, Sass layers more gracefully than C does over x86, since compiler-generated x86 is incomprehensible, and Sass-generated CSS is probably more readable than what a typical designer produces. Sass also promotes CSS best practices, in part by automating them, and in part by providing syntactic sugar for them. If your designers can't grok Sass, you do what every professional team using template languages has always done; you back-and-forth with the designer in CSS/HTML, and you convert final comps to templates. Designers by and large don't speak Haml, Erb, Clearsilver, or Cheetarah (or Mum-raah or whatever Django calls it) either.
        wvenable 17y ago
        The designers produce the CSS, I don't. In most cases, they use their fancy tools to produce it. If they're not using SASS, what's the advantage to me? Why would I convert their CSS to SASS to get the same result in the end? Templates are a different story -- that's where the design and the functionality meet. I do convert the final comps to templates and if necessary the templates back into static code to repeat the process (rarely necessary, but it happens). This is a necessary evil. Why would I want to perpetuate that evil in CSS as well?
        17y ago
- ThinkWriteMute 17y ago
  Don't ever make assumptions about what I do or how I design. You're an ignorant sod for making said assumptions in an attempt to defend SASS.
some1else 17y ago
Do you have any reasonable supporting argument for that statement? This reads close to: "iPhone takes it way too far. Phones are for calling people, not surfing the web and running applications"
- ThinkWriteMute 17y ago
  Sorry, it's not. The iPhone brought major improvements and some really awesome ideas. SASS brings nothing to the table that hasn't already been done and it fails to even do the standard things better. SASS was a great idea for writing CSS easier. Now it's just a crappy programming language that works with CSS. CSS needs to be made easier, HTML needs to be made easier. Making it a Turning Certified language is no way to do that. Sometimes you need a hammer. Most of the time you don't need a hammer with six gauges and a penis pump. CSS is one of those times.
tptacek 17y ago
Why?

That what CSS is, but that doesn't mean that's the only way to style a website. Use your imagination and stop accepting the constraints that have been placed on you by those who got here first.

wvenable 17y ago
Some constraints are good. If it's not for constraints, you'd have cats marrying dogs and so on. Putting programming logic in a stylesheet language is asking for more complexity, not less. I agree with the author. CSS is universal. SASS is entirely different language with far less "speakers" and far less support. It may be superior to CSS, but that's only part of the equation.
- tptacek 17y ago
  x86 assembly language is similarly universal. Nobody writes in it.
  - wvenable 17y ago
    CSS is closer to C than x86 (and C is more universal) Are you going to say nobody writes in that, too? Edit: I meant universal in that everyone reads/writes it -- not that it's the lowest level. Yes, nobody writes x86 so it's not similarly universal. C is pretty universal. Even if you code in Java, C#, or PHP you've still got a lot of C heritage there.
    - tptacek 17y ago
      I have no idea what your point is. People write in Java, Ruby, Lisp, Javascript, and any of 50 other languages to avoid writing bare-metal C, too.
      - wvenable 17y ago
        I'm not sure what your point is! Your original comment about x86 doesn't even make sense -- most people don't know x86 assembler! However, all web designers know CSS. Nearly all web developers know CSS. That's what makes it universal! It's not about how low-level it is. We recently had to fire a design team and are in the process of moving to a different team. If all the styles were in SASS, I'd have a much bigger problem. Even something like LessCSS has a much smaller learning curve because it looks like CSS. You can use it much more minimally (using only variables, for example) and get a small benefit with a small learning curve. Think of how many of those 50 other languages look like C.
        tptacek 17y ago
        It really seems like you don't understand how Sass works, or at least haven't actually run it. If anything, Sass layers more gracefully than C does over x86, since compiler-generated x86 is incomprehensible, and Sass-generated CSS is probably more readable than what a typical designer produces. Sass also promotes CSS best practices, in part by automating them, and in part by providing syntactic sugar for them. If your designers can't grok Sass, you do what every professional team using template languages has always done; you back-and-forth with the designer in CSS/HTML, and you convert final comps to templates. Designers by and large don't speak Haml, Erb, Clearsilver, or Cheetarah (or Mum-raah or whatever Django calls it) either.
        wvenable 17y ago
        The designers produce the CSS, I don't. In most cases, they use their fancy tools to produce it. If they're not using SASS, what's the advantage to me? Why would I convert their CSS to SASS to get the same result in the end? Templates are a different story -- that's where the design and the functionality meet. I do convert the final comps to templates and if necessary the templates back into static code to repeat the process (rarely necessary, but it happens). This is a necessary evil. Why would I want to perpetuate that evil in CSS as well?
        17y ago
ThinkWriteMute 17y ago
Don't ever make assumptions about what I do or how I design. You're an ignorant sod for making said assumptions in an attempt to defend SASS.

some1else 17y ago

Do you have any reasonable supporting argument for that statement? This reads close to: "iPhone takes it way too far. Phones are for calling people, not surfing the web and running applications"

ThinkWriteMute 17y ago
Sorry, it's not. The iPhone brought major improvements and some really awesome ideas. SASS brings nothing to the table that hasn't already been done and it fails to even do the standard things better. SASS was a great idea for writing CSS easier. Now it's just a crappy programming language that works with CSS. CSS needs to be made easier, HTML needs to be made easier. Making it a Turning Certified language is no way to do that. Sometimes you need a hammer. Most of the time you don't need a hammer with six gauges and a penis pump. CSS is one of those times.

tptacek 17y ago

Why?