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I hope they succeed in taking away some market share from TOEFL. The TOEFL test is ridiculously overpriced for what they provide and your results expire (no jok

by rkrzr 11y ago

I hope they succeed in taking away some market share from TOEFL. The TOEFL test is ridiculously overpriced for what they provide and your results expire (no joke) after 2 years. Since clearly you will have forgotten everything you knew about that language in 2 years time... Go Duolingo!

Grue3 11y ago
>Since clearly you will have forgotten everything you knew about that language in 2 years time... They are not wrong. I passed Duolingo Spanish course (it might have been extended since then) and barely remember anything now. I was also studying German in school, and later French by myself to the point where I could even speak with native speakers a little. Hardly remember anything either. English is the only foreign language that I haven't forgot because I use it constantly. But if you're not using a foreign language, after passing the test you will completely forget it in 2 years.
- rkrzr 11y ago
  "But if you're not using a foreign language, after passing the test you will completely forget it in 2 years" You usually take this test because you will have to speak this language, so the case where you take the test and then do nothing with it seems pretty unlikely. Also, I disagree with your assumption that you will completely forget another language in 2 years (even when not used). I cannot confirm this from my own experience.
- raverbashing 11y ago
  This, to me, is very telling I spent a lot of time barely using certain foreign languages (+ than 2 years). Of course you get 'rusty', but far from forgetting everything. And it came up back quickly This tell me Duolingo doesn't make you learn it, but rather memorize their game.
  - Someone1234 11y ago
    And while that may be the case, it is ultimately a free Rosetta Stone. So if it fails to work you're only out just time, with Rosetta Stone you're out time and also hundreds of dollars. I'd love to see a independent study into its reliability/retention. But even if it is completely useless, it is still no more wasteful than any other mobile game people play daily.
    - bayesianhorse 11y ago
      There is one referenced on their homepage. On average, 34 hours of study in the Spanish course would be equivalent to a full semester of language education in college. For me that would be about a month of practice. I have seen the effects myself. After a month or so, even though I had learned some spanish before, native speakers suddenly slowed down (in my perception). An important clue: Use the "Strengthen your skills" button frequently to keep the tree golden. Duolingo itself doesn't nag you enough to do that, but it's essential for mastery of the language.
  - freehunter 11y ago
    There is no way to permanently learn a language if you're not using it. I have known coworkers who grew up in the US for the first 20-something years of their life and then moved to other countries and have begun the process of forgetting English. Their first language. The one they were taught as babies. Remember this: everyone is taught their perfect grammar and spelling and quizzed on it for years in school. How many people can say what a past participle is, or even what an adverb is? How many people who passed geometry can still do that level of math from the top of their heads? Of course you can't permanently learn something. You have to keep it in practice.
  - bayesianhorse 11y ago
    That's not true. Memorization is the most efficient way of learning a language, but it often comes in forms which aren't as obvious. For example you can look at reading foreign texts as a kind of repetition for every word you encounter. It's hard to master and complete a Duolingo course without getting a grip on the language. You'd have to pretty much ignore the "Strengthen your skills" button and never repeat anything. Even after finishing a course you should use the repetitions for weeks and months to keep refreshing your memory. That's the only way it may stay forever.
- bayesianhorse 11y ago
  The trick is to keep repeating the exercises for at least a few weeks after you have finished the course. I can guarantee you that you didn't forget everything. If you completed the Spanish course, your brain has been rewired for Spanish...
S4M 11y ago
When I took the TOEIC (it was mandatory to get my diploma), the people in charge of the exams said that the TOEIC score is only valid one or two years (can't remember which) and if we spend some time in an English speaking country it was advised to take a TOEIC again as our score would be likely to increase. I was thinking at the time (it was in 2005) that they were really out of touch with common sense, and right now I wonder if anybody outside academia gives some credibility to the TOEIC or the TOEFL.

by rkrzr 11y ago

Grue3 11y ago

>Since clearly you will have forgotten everything you knew about that language in 2 years time... They are not wrong. I passed Duolingo Spanish course (it might have been extended since then) and barely remember anything now. I was also studying German in school, and later French by myself to the point where I could even speak with native speakers a little. Hardly remember anything either. English is the only foreign language that I haven't forgot because I use it constantly. But if you're not using a foreign language, after passing the test you will completely forget it in 2 years.

rkrzr 11y ago
"But if you're not using a foreign language, after passing the test you will completely forget it in 2 years" You usually take this test because you will have to speak this language, so the case where you take the test and then do nothing with it seems pretty unlikely. Also, I disagree with your assumption that you will completely forget another language in 2 years (even when not used). I cannot confirm this from my own experience.
raverbashing 11y ago
This, to me, is very telling I spent a lot of time barely using certain foreign languages (+ than 2 years). Of course you get 'rusty', but far from forgetting everything. And it came up back quickly This tell me Duolingo doesn't make you learn it, but rather memorize their game.
- Someone1234 11y ago
  And while that may be the case, it is ultimately a free Rosetta Stone. So if it fails to work you're only out just time, with Rosetta Stone you're out time and also hundreds of dollars. I'd love to see a independent study into its reliability/retention. But even if it is completely useless, it is still no more wasteful than any other mobile game people play daily.
  - bayesianhorse 11y ago
    There is one referenced on their homepage. On average, 34 hours of study in the Spanish course would be equivalent to a full semester of language education in college. For me that would be about a month of practice. I have seen the effects myself. After a month or so, even though I had learned some spanish before, native speakers suddenly slowed down (in my perception). An important clue: Use the "Strengthen your skills" button frequently to keep the tree golden. Duolingo itself doesn't nag you enough to do that, but it's essential for mastery of the language.
- freehunter 11y ago
  There is no way to permanently learn a language if you're not using it. I have known coworkers who grew up in the US for the first 20-something years of their life and then moved to other countries and have begun the process of forgetting English. Their first language. The one they were taught as babies. Remember this: everyone is taught their perfect grammar and spelling and quizzed on it for years in school. How many people can say what a past participle is, or even what an adverb is? How many people who passed geometry can still do that level of math from the top of their heads? Of course you can't permanently learn something. You have to keep it in practice.
- bayesianhorse 11y ago
  That's not true. Memorization is the most efficient way of learning a language, but it often comes in forms which aren't as obvious. For example you can look at reading foreign texts as a kind of repetition for every word you encounter. It's hard to master and complete a Duolingo course without getting a grip on the language. You'd have to pretty much ignore the "Strengthen your skills" button and never repeat anything. Even after finishing a course you should use the repetitions for weeks and months to keep refreshing your memory. That's the only way it may stay forever.
bayesianhorse 11y ago
The trick is to keep repeating the exercises for at least a few weeks after you have finished the course. I can guarantee you that you didn't forget everything. If you completed the Spanish course, your brain has been rewired for Spanish...

S4M 11y ago

When I took the TOEIC (it was mandatory to get my diploma), the people in charge of the exams said that the TOEIC score is only valid one or two years (can't remember which) and if we spend some time in an English speaking country it was advised to take a TOEIC again as our score would be likely to increase. I was thinking at the time (it was in 2005) that they were really out of touch with common sense, and right now I wonder if anybody outside academia gives some credibility to the TOEIC or the TOEFL.