4 ms·

Jewels from an Ethiopian grave reveal 2,000-year-old link to Rome

57 points by diodorus 11y ago

staunch 11y ago
Archaeological news is always frustrating due to the lack of pictures. I would love to look through dozens of high res photos of this find, but I doubt I'll ever get the chance.
- robinsloan 11y ago
  Why "ever"? It seems to me like more & more artifacts like this are getting photographed -- and/or even scanned in 3D! -- and posted online. But maybe you're alluding to something in the culture of archaeology I don't know about...? Just curious.
  - VLM 11y ago
    GirlWithTrowel alludes to working under a press embargo. One woman's blog is not proof of much, however, press embargos are BAU for NASA missions, PIs get a year to publish before the results are public, however media coverage disappears a couple hours after mission events. So at least in mass "push" media, the data is never distributed beyond occasional PR team low res footage. It would not be surprising if press/publicity stuff works the same for archeology missions as NASA missions, after all they're all academia employed PHDs trying to get published in journals, so convergent evolution and all that. All the data is eventually released "somewhere" usually on a public website, but it takes awhile.
- toyg 11y ago
  The problem is that priority must be conservation, so items are likely stored away very quickly and examined later with all due care. Pics will eventually emerge through studies and papers. But yeah, I agree with the sentiment. Maybe archeologists should film their proceedings, it would make things easier later on.
megaman22 11y ago
tldr; Luxury goods were widely traded, even in the ancient era. We're supposed to be astounded that Roman goods were found in ancient Ethiopian graves, when said ancient Ethiopian kingdom lay athwart one of the main ancient trade routes linking the Mediterranean and India/Southeast Asia. Pliny the Elder complained about how much specie this trade was leeching out of the Roman economy, in terms that echo criticisms of the BEIC before the establishment of the opium trade [1]. 1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Roman_trade_relations#Establishment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Roman_trade_relations#Esta...
- toyg 11y ago
  > Luxury goods were widely traded, even in the ancient era. Especially in the ancient era. As the security of the Roman Empire started to decline across the Mediterranean, long-distance trade routes were disrupted and it often took several centuries before they could be "rediscovered" by Europeans.
- dang 11y ago
  > We're supposed to be astounded that Roman goods were found in ancient Ethiopian graves, when said ancient Ethiopian kingdom lay athwart one of the main ancient trade routes linking the Mediterranean and India/Southeast Asia This is an interesting comment, but it reads to me like you're dismissing new work, and that is something we need to see less of on HN. The article doesn't say you're "supposed to be astounded". It describes "evidence that the Romans were trading [in Ethiopia] hundreds of years earlier than previously thought". Your claim seems to be that the Romans traded with India, Ethiopia was near that route, and therefore these goods could have just spilled over into Ethiopian graves. That's fascinating. And it would be fine (more than fine!) to pose it as a question. But it doesn't justify the crushing-objection-on-internet-forum genre. It's possible, of course, that (once again) a crushing internet objection has demonstrated the triviality of some discovery with a wave of the hand and a Wikipedia link. But the odds are much greater that the researchers are aware of such objections and (were they here) could tell us why the evidence they found is stronger than random spillage can explain—or any number of other details or arguments that didn't make it into this story. Given those odds, the burden is on you to be less dismissive, and certainly less snarky, even if you do know their field better than they do. Aside from the above, I enjoyed this comment and learned from it. I'm emphasizing the procedural issue because HN, like a lot of places on the internet, has a big problem with this.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
comrade1 11y ago
That's not surprising at all. There are older ties between Ethiopia and Egypt and between Rome and Egypt. By 1000 years or my be even more (I mean the Mediterranean, not Rome, that early)
budu3 11y ago
>The finds will go to a new German-funded museum, opening in October. Schofield hopes to organise a loan to the British Museum Why isn't the find staying with the Ethiopian people?
- unmole 11y ago
  > German-funded museum Quite possible the museum is actually in Ethiopia

57 points by diodorus 11y ago

Archaeological news is always frustrating due to the lack of pictures. I would love to look through dozens of high res photos of this find, but I doubt I'll ever get the chance.

robinsloan 11y ago
Why "ever"? It seems to me like more & more artifacts like this are getting photographed -- and/or even scanned in 3D! -- and posted online. But maybe you're alluding to something in the culture of archaeology I don't know about...? Just curious.
- VLM 11y ago
  GirlWithTrowel alludes to working under a press embargo. One woman's blog is not proof of much, however, press embargos are BAU for NASA missions, PIs get a year to publish before the results are public, however media coverage disappears a couple hours after mission events. So at least in mass "push" media, the data is never distributed beyond occasional PR team low res footage. It would not be surprising if press/publicity stuff works the same for archeology missions as NASA missions, after all they're all academia employed PHDs trying to get published in journals, so convergent evolution and all that. All the data is eventually released "somewhere" usually on a public website, but it takes awhile.
toyg 11y ago
The problem is that priority must be conservation, so items are likely stored away very quickly and examined later with all due care. Pics will eventually emerge through studies and papers. But yeah, I agree with the sentiment. Maybe archeologists should film their proceedings, it would make things easier later on.

megaman22 11y ago

tldr; Luxury goods were widely traded, even in the ancient era. We're supposed to be astounded that Roman goods were found in ancient Ethiopian graves, when said ancient Ethiopian kingdom lay athwart one of the main ancient trade routes linking the Mediterranean and India/Southeast Asia. Pliny the Elder complained about how much specie this trade was leeching out of the Roman economy, in terms that echo criticisms of the BEIC before the establishment of the opium trade [1]. 1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Roman_trade_relations#Establishment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Roman_trade_relations#Esta...

toyg 11y ago
> Luxury goods were widely traded, even in the ancient era. Especially in the ancient era. As the security of the Roman Empire started to decline across the Mediterranean, long-distance trade routes were disrupted and it often took several centuries before they could be "rediscovered" by Europeans.
dang 11y ago
> We're supposed to be astounded that Roman goods were found in ancient Ethiopian graves, when said ancient Ethiopian kingdom lay athwart one of the main ancient trade routes linking the Mediterranean and India/Southeast Asia This is an interesting comment, but it reads to me like you're dismissing new work, and that is something we need to see less of on HN. The article doesn't say you're "supposed to be astounded". It describes "evidence that the Romans were trading [in Ethiopia] hundreds of years earlier than previously thought". Your claim seems to be that the Romans traded with India, Ethiopia was near that route, and therefore these goods could have just spilled over into Ethiopian graves. That's fascinating. And it would be fine (more than fine!) to pose it as a question. But it doesn't justify the crushing-objection-on-internet-forum genre. It's possible, of course, that (once again) a crushing internet objection has demonstrated the triviality of some discovery with a wave of the hand and a Wikipedia link. But the odds are much greater that the researchers are aware of such objections and (were they here) could tell us why the evidence they found is stronger than random spillage can explain—or any number of other details or arguments that didn't make it into this story. Given those odds, the burden is on you to be less dismissive, and certainly less snarky, even if you do know their field better than they do. Aside from the above, I enjoyed this comment and learned from it. I'm emphasizing the procedural issue because HN, like a lot of places on the internet, has a big problem with this.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

comrade1 11y ago

That's not surprising at all. There are older ties between Ethiopia and Egypt and between Rome and Egypt. By 1000 years or my be even more (I mean the Mediterranean, not Rome, that early)

budu3 11y ago

>The finds will go to a new German-funded museum, opening in October. Schofield hopes to organise a loan to the British Museum Why isn't the find staying with the Ethiopian people?

unmole 11y ago
> German-funded museum Quite possible the museum is actually in Ethiopia