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The problem with buses is that they're completely unpredictable. You might as well not even look at the schedule. There's also the issue of having to purchase y

The problem with buses is that they're completely unpredictable. You might as well not even look at the schedule. There's also the issue of having to purchase your ticket; buses rarely have automatic kiosks as do trains and light rail, and you often have to talk to the operator to get your ticket. Finally, bus routes are byzantine and completely impossible to unravel by looking at a map. Rail systems are much more amenable to mapping, and if you're lost, you can always find a rail stop just by looking under your feet or giving your favorite mapping app a quick scan.

bryanlarsen 11y ago
None of those problems apply to proper BRT systems. That's the author's point.
- justinator 11y ago
  In the opinion of myself, and perhaps others, a "proper" BRT system is few and far between. Even the system their describing in the article is almost exactly what they're creating in real live between Denver and Boulder, but many compromises have been made, and it's not going to work out as originally planned. Funnily, part the funding was through a program called, "Fast Tracks", which - you guessed it, was money allocated for a lightrail system that... wasn't created.
- archagon 11y ago
  I don't see how you can avoid delays if you still have to follow traffic.
  - bryanlarsen 11y ago
    Good BRT systems use tunnels / bridges to avoid traffic. When they do interact with traffic lights, they have priority access.
- TheCoelacanth 11y ago
  But proper BRT is very rare because it costs almost as much to build as light rail. If you are going to put that much money into it, you might as well spend a bit more and get the other advantages of light rail, e.g. lower operating costs, higher passenger capacity, lower emissions, less noise pollution, smoother ride, etc.
- dspeyer 11y ago
  The likelihood of getting a proper BRT system when a city sets out to build one seems a lot lower than the probability of getting working light rail. Granted, both are low. In NYC, we have "dedicated lanes" for some of our buses. But there are no spikes in the ground and when someone parks in one, the bus doesn't actually smash the car out of the way. So we're back to the mercy of traffic.
Mister_Snuggles 11y ago
As always, it depends. Some transit systems are better than others, and some routes are better than others. I've recently started taking the bus to work and have found that most of the routes keep to their schedule quite well. The local transit system is also rolling out smart bus technology which, among other things, provides real-time location information on each bus. This is available online and through the transit system's app. It's also used by a third-party app, Transit, which is quite good. Based on my experience, the bus always arrives within a minute of its schedule in the morning. It tends to fall behind near the end of its route in the evening rush hour, though the most I've seen has been 10 minutes (according to the operator's console [when the bus has the smart bus stuff]). This is at the end of a cross-city route, so 10 minutes behind when the bus is passing through at least two construction zones is actually really good. I should note that the route I take is an express route. I used to take a non-express bus that followed the same path (up to where I got off anyway) and it was a nightmare - usually behind schedule, too many people, too many stops and starts. I decided that the express bus was worth the longer walk. As for mapping, this is true, but only because there are so many routes relative to rail. Google Maps helps immensely, but it is not perfect. As for talking to the operator, it's not strictly required, usually you can just deposit your fare in the box and he hands you a ticket. That said, I always thank the operator when I get off. This is the guy that is driving through the traffic so that I don't have to, the least I could do is say thanks. I also make it a point when driving to do what I can to make things easier on the buses, for the same reason.
- archagon 11y ago
  Oh, that reminds me: there's also the creeping paranoia that your bus could get there early and leave you behind. I have never had this happen with a train, but I routinely see busses barreling past the stop. And when a route has dozens of stops, you just know the driver isn't checking their clock at every one. But yeah, smart buses are a great improvement. I love bus stops where they actually tell you how much time is left until the next bus. Can't wait until Apple/Google implement real-time bus tracking in their mapping apps. (I think Google is already doing this in certain areas?)
  - 11y ago

bryanlarsen 11y ago

None of those problems apply to proper BRT systems. That's the author's point.

justinator 11y ago
In the opinion of myself, and perhaps others, a "proper" BRT system is few and far between. Even the system their describing in the article is almost exactly what they're creating in real live between Denver and Boulder, but many compromises have been made, and it's not going to work out as originally planned. Funnily, part the funding was through a program called, "Fast Tracks", which - you guessed it, was money allocated for a lightrail system that... wasn't created.
archagon 11y ago
I don't see how you can avoid delays if you still have to follow traffic.
- bryanlarsen 11y ago
  Good BRT systems use tunnels / bridges to avoid traffic. When they do interact with traffic lights, they have priority access.
TheCoelacanth 11y ago
But proper BRT is very rare because it costs almost as much to build as light rail. If you are going to put that much money into it, you might as well spend a bit more and get the other advantages of light rail, e.g. lower operating costs, higher passenger capacity, lower emissions, less noise pollution, smoother ride, etc.
dspeyer 11y ago
The likelihood of getting a proper BRT system when a city sets out to build one seems a lot lower than the probability of getting working light rail. Granted, both are low. In NYC, we have "dedicated lanes" for some of our buses. But there are no spikes in the ground and when someone parks in one, the bus doesn't actually smash the car out of the way. So we're back to the mercy of traffic.

Mister_Snuggles 11y ago

As always, it depends. Some transit systems are better than others, and some routes are better than others. I've recently started taking the bus to work and have found that most of the routes keep to their schedule quite well. The local transit system is also rolling out smart bus technology which, among other things, provides real-time location information on each bus. This is available online and through the transit system's app. It's also used by a third-party app, Transit, which is quite good. Based on my experience, the bus always arrives within a minute of its schedule in the morning. It tends to fall behind near the end of its route in the evening rush hour, though the most I've seen has been 10 minutes (according to the operator's console [when the bus has the smart bus stuff]). This is at the end of a cross-city route, so 10 minutes behind when the bus is passing through at least two construction zones is actually really good. I should note that the route I take is an express route. I used to take a non-express bus that followed the same path (up to where I got off anyway) and it was a nightmare - usually behind schedule, too many people, too many stops and starts. I decided that the express bus was worth the longer walk. As for mapping, this is true, but only because there are so many routes relative to rail. Google Maps helps immensely, but it is not perfect. As for talking to the operator, it's not strictly required, usually you can just deposit your fare in the box and he hands you a ticket. That said, I always thank the operator when I get off. This is the guy that is driving through the traffic so that I don't have to, the least I could do is say thanks. I also make it a point when driving to do what I can to make things easier on the buses, for the same reason.

archagon 11y ago
Oh, that reminds me: there's also the creeping paranoia that your bus could get there early and leave you behind. I have never had this happen with a train, but I routinely see busses barreling past the stop. And when a route has dozens of stops, you just know the driver isn't checking their clock at every one. But yeah, smart buses are a great improvement. I love bus stops where they actually tell you how much time is left until the next bus. Can't wait until Apple/Google implement real-time bus tracking in their mapping apps. (I think Google is already doing this in certain areas?)
- 11y ago