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It's wrong to break into foreign computers and spy on people. If China did it to you would not think, "oh china, you rascally superpower". You would be scared s

by guelo 11y ago

It's wrong to break into foreign computers and spy on people. If China did it to you would not think, "oh china, you rascally superpower". You would be scared shitless and would contact the FBI. It's state sponsored terrorism. It's also, technically, an act of war.

TeMPOraL 11y ago
No, it's just bog-standard espionage, something that everyone knows everybody does and everyone tries to prevent others from doing it on them (AKA. counterintelligence). If you go and start breaking things, then it can be considered an act of war.
linkregister 11y ago
I'm in doubt about any real negative diplomatic or economic repercussions that prolific Chinese computer espionage has yielded for China. The strongest American responses to Chinese espionage have been from the Google and Github corporations. The U.S. government issues tepid responses [1] [2] [3] to incidents that would be considered some of the most impressive and extreme acts of espionage. (The U.S. government issued indictments for the operators behind [2], but this is essentially a no-op since they need to be on U.S. soil to be arrested.) The fact is that the major powers of the world conduct espionage and that disclosures are not handled as acts of war. Discovered spies are typically placed in a persona non grata diplomatic status and granted safe passage back to their home countries. See U.S. spy Ryan Fogle. [4] I don't mean to pick on China; I addressed it because it was the example you gave. Every major power has had at least one widespread computer espionage campaign discovered by Kaspersky, Symantec, Mandiant/FireEye, etc. [1] http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-29817644 http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-29817644 (White House computer intrusion by China) [2] http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21502088 http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21502088 (U.S. Defense contractors' networks intrusion by China) [3] http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21271849 http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21271849 (New York Times network intrusion by China) [4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_declared_persona_non_grata http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_declared_persona...
tzs 11y ago
> If China did it to you would not think, "oh china, you rascally superpower" What do you mean if China did it? They do do it. So does Russia. So does North Korea. So does the US. There is essentially the cyber equivalent of the Cold War going on right now, and attempting to get into each other's systems, especially infrastructure systems like power plant control systems, is the equivalent of flying fighters provocatively close to someone else's border.

by guelo 11y ago

TeMPOraL 11y ago

No, it's just bog-standard espionage, something that everyone knows everybody does and everyone tries to prevent others from doing it on them (AKA. counterintelligence). If you go and start breaking things, then it can be considered an act of war.

linkregister 11y ago

I'm in doubt about any real negative diplomatic or economic repercussions that prolific Chinese computer espionage has yielded for China. The strongest American responses to Chinese espionage have been from the Google and Github corporations. The U.S. government issues tepid responses [1] [2] [3] to incidents that would be considered some of the most impressive and extreme acts of espionage. (The U.S. government issued indictments for the operators behind [2], but this is essentially a no-op since they need to be on U.S. soil to be arrested.) The fact is that the major powers of the world conduct espionage and that disclosures are not handled as acts of war. Discovered spies are typically placed in a persona non grata diplomatic status and granted safe passage back to their home countries. See U.S. spy Ryan Fogle. [4] I don't mean to pick on China; I addressed it because it was the example you gave. Every major power has had at least one widespread computer espionage campaign discovered by Kaspersky, Symantec, Mandiant/FireEye, etc. [1] http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-29817644 http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-29817644 (White House computer intrusion by China) [2] http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21502088 http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21502088 (U.S. Defense contractors' networks intrusion by China) [3] http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21271849 http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21271849 (New York Times network intrusion by China) [4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_declared_persona_non_grata http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_declared_persona...

tzs 11y ago

> If China did it to you would not think, "oh china, you rascally superpower" What do you mean if China did it? They do do it. So does Russia. So does North Korea. So does the US. There is essentially the cyber equivalent of the Cold War going on right now, and attempting to get into each other's systems, especially infrastructure systems like power plant control systems, is the equivalent of flying fighters provocatively close to someone else's border.