4 ms·

In the investigation, undercover agents were able to get prohibited items through security checkpoints in 67 of 70 instances. I don't understand this. As the

by bbarn 11y ago

In the investigation, undercover agents were able to get prohibited items through security checkpoints in 67 of 70 instances. I don't understand this. As the majority of the intelligent people I talk to seem to understand that the TSA is essentially theatre, why seek to prove that fact to the rest of the population? Are these organizations actually buying what they're selling? I guess I just figured all these agents knew they didn't really serve any practical purpose other than keeping people feeling "better".

GauntletWizard 11y ago
To justify bigger budgets and further invasion of the right to privacy, of course. This is a power game, and always has been. Making people more afraid to travel is just one aspect of it.
- hashmymustache 11y ago
  Ironically becoming its own form of terrorism.
PakG1 11y ago
I'm not sure what's worse. Assuming that people knowingly and deliberately work dead-end jobs with no purpose, or assuming that people are too stupid to not know anything. I remember standing in line to go through baggage checking. A lady in front of me chatted it up with the TSA worker. She said thank you for the work, can't imagine how frustrating it must be sometimes. He replied thank you for appreciating it. Hanlon's Razor is useful here. I believe most people out there are just trying to do their job as well as they can and make a living. They aren't thinking about the bigger picture, and it's easy for many of them to think their jobs have meaning. In fact, I think that's a requirement for not getting depressed. No need to demean anyone. Most of the intelligent people I know don't even know what security theatre is when I discuss it with them. I think people who have concerns about security theatre are in the minority, judging from my own sampling. I haven't seen any official studies on the question as to how many people even understand or have heard of the term security theatre. I would love to review them if the studies exist.
- jedberg 11y ago
  > She said thank you for the work, can't imagine how frustrating it must be sometimes. He replied thank you for appreciating it. To be fair, I'm 100% sure of the fact that it is theater, but I still chat up the agent and thank them for their hard work. It makes my time in line go faster as I'm asking for an opt-out.
- vinhboy 11y ago
  I agree with you that for the people hired to carry out these policies, they are just regular folks who take great pride in doing/having a job. However, after watching those PBS Frotline documentaries "Top Secret America" and seeing that Lindsay Graham speech this morning, it's clear to me that many of the people who head these agencies are paranoid and delusional. I don't know how they keep amassing so much power and influence.
  - kordless 11y ago
    Because the paranoid and delusional desire power?
  - anigbrowl 11y ago
    Because a substantial fraction of the population is paranoid and delusional and actively supports such policies.
sremani 11y ago
While they are rearranging the chairs on the deck of titanic, they will ask for a huge check for improved training and better equipment and increased staff in the DC to monitor, evaluate and rectify the short-comings. The result for the passengers would be more invasive practices and more hoops to jump as well as big lines. Failing upwards is an Art, DC has perfected.
ars 11y ago
Just because it is theater doesn't mean they want it to be theater. So presumably they feel they should at least be able to detect the threats tested against.
bitJericho 11y ago
Never suspect malice when it could easily be explained with incompetence.
gcb0 11y ago
it is all politics "i had the last word" now. the laws that Obama and the majority whip called to be passed, weren't. Now they will have to dismantle several parts of TSA and NSA. This is just to say "I didn't even want it anyway"
Manishearth 11y ago
I thought this too. Not exactly that it's theatre, but it will deter smaller groups / less motivated individuals from doing anything. A coordinated group could bypass almost anything they put up anyway, just that they don't.
higherpurpose 11y ago
I think there was a "do you trust the TSA to keep you safe?" study about a year ago, and I think something like 55% said "yes". Most people must believe that it "feels safer" when the TSA is seemingly "checking everything". And would probably be "worried" if tomorrow the TSA didn't exist anymore, even if that fear is irrational in this context considering the facts that the TSA is already useless.
Shivetya 11y ago
because if TSA leadership is like that of any other failing institution they truly don't think they are doing it wrong. No one in a position of authority is allowed to question them and they simply laugh at all the "conspiracy" and such on the internet. Sadly this is pretty much how all government works, they think they are the smartest people they know and everyone else just needs to shut up and do what they are told. When presented contrary evidence the rebuttal will be "you don't know the big picture" and when irrefutable evidence is provided a sacrificial lamb or two is trotted out under the idea "it was really just one person" and they continue doing what they do

by bbarn 11y ago

GauntletWizard 11y ago

To justify bigger budgets and further invasion of the right to privacy, of course. This is a power game, and always has been. Making people more afraid to travel is just one aspect of it.

hashmymustache 11y ago
Ironically becoming its own form of terrorism.

PakG1 11y ago

I'm not sure what's worse. Assuming that people knowingly and deliberately work dead-end jobs with no purpose, or assuming that people are too stupid to not know anything. I remember standing in line to go through baggage checking. A lady in front of me chatted it up with the TSA worker. She said thank you for the work, can't imagine how frustrating it must be sometimes. He replied thank you for appreciating it. Hanlon's Razor is useful here. I believe most people out there are just trying to do their job as well as they can and make a living. They aren't thinking about the bigger picture, and it's easy for many of them to think their jobs have meaning. In fact, I think that's a requirement for not getting depressed. No need to demean anyone. Most of the intelligent people I know don't even know what security theatre is when I discuss it with them. I think people who have concerns about security theatre are in the minority, judging from my own sampling. I haven't seen any official studies on the question as to how many people even understand or have heard of the term security theatre. I would love to review them if the studies exist.

jedberg 11y ago
> She said thank you for the work, can't imagine how frustrating it must be sometimes. He replied thank you for appreciating it. To be fair, I'm 100% sure of the fact that it is theater, but I still chat up the agent and thank them for their hard work. It makes my time in line go faster as I'm asking for an opt-out.
vinhboy 11y ago
I agree with you that for the people hired to carry out these policies, they are just regular folks who take great pride in doing/having a job. However, after watching those PBS Frotline documentaries "Top Secret America" and seeing that Lindsay Graham speech this morning, it's clear to me that many of the people who head these agencies are paranoid and delusional. I don't know how they keep amassing so much power and influence.
- kordless 11y ago
  Because the paranoid and delusional desire power?
- anigbrowl 11y ago
  Because a substantial fraction of the population is paranoid and delusional and actively supports such policies.

sremani 11y ago

While they are rearranging the chairs on the deck of titanic, they will ask for a huge check for improved training and better equipment and increased staff in the DC to monitor, evaluate and rectify the short-comings. The result for the passengers would be more invasive practices and more hoops to jump as well as big lines. Failing upwards is an Art, DC has perfected.

ars 11y ago

Just because it is theater doesn't mean they want it to be theater. So presumably they feel they should at least be able to detect the threats tested against.

bitJericho 11y ago

Never suspect malice when it could easily be explained with incompetence.

gcb0 11y ago

it is all politics "i had the last word" now. the laws that Obama and the majority whip called to be passed, weren't. Now they will have to dismantle several parts of TSA and NSA. This is just to say "I didn't even want it anyway"

Manishearth 11y ago

I thought this too. Not exactly that it's theatre, but it will deter smaller groups / less motivated individuals from doing anything. A coordinated group could bypass almost anything they put up anyway, just that they don't.

higherpurpose 11y ago

I think there was a "do you trust the TSA to keep you safe?" study about a year ago, and I think something like 55% said "yes". Most people must believe that it "feels safer" when the TSA is seemingly "checking everything". And would probably be "worried" if tomorrow the TSA didn't exist anymore, even if that fear is irrational in this context considering the facts that the TSA is already useless.

Shivetya 11y ago

because if TSA leadership is like that of any other failing institution they truly don't think they are doing it wrong. No one in a position of authority is allowed to question them and they simply laugh at all the "conspiracy" and such on the internet. Sadly this is pretty much how all government works, they think they are the smartest people they know and everyone else just needs to shut up and do what they are told. When presented contrary evidence the rebuttal will be "you don't know the big picture" and when irrefutable evidence is provided a sacrificial lamb or two is trotted out under the idea "it was really just one person" and they continue doing what they do