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There are rich people and there are powerful people, and there is a lot of overlap between the two. Some of the rich people sometimes do relatively a lot to he
by graycat 11y ago
There are rich people and there are
powerful people, and there is a lot of
overlap between the two.
Some of the rich people sometimes do
relatively a lot to help the poor people.
E.g., there are Bill and Melinda Gates,
and they also got Warren Buffett to
allocate nearly all of his fortune. And
little Melinda, sweetheart, got lots of
other rich people to sign up for her 50%
or so 'giving pledge'
http://givingpledge.org/ http://givingpledge.org/
Net, apparently Melinda has, via Bill,
Warren, and others, moved well over $100
billion into philanthropy. Andrew
Carnegie? Lots of libraries, especially
good for poor people. Andrew Mellon? The
US National Gallery of Art -- free for
everyone. Michael Bloomberg -- $1+
billion to The Johns Hopkins University,
especially to its medical school for
progress in medicine that helps lots of
people, including poor people. And we
could construct a much longer list.
From all I can tell, if the poor people
have a valid gripe, then it is with some
of the power of the powerful people and
not much with the money of the rich
people, and here is why:
Shockingly, in simple terms, for the most
direct purposes of the poor people, the
rich people don't have much money!
Sure, each of the 1000 richest people
could buy a new Ferrari for themselves,
but they definitely can't buy a new
Ferrari for each poor person -- even if
Ferrari could make that many cars.
Or let's consider 'wealth redistribution'
and do a little arithmetic:
Let's look a little at the wealthiest
people in the US; for some data, let's
look, say, at the 2014 Forbes 400 as at
http://www.forbes.com/forbes-400/ http://www.forbes.com/forbes-400/
There we see that the 400 people on that
list are worth in total
$2.29 trillion.
The least wealthy person on that list is
worth
$1.55 billion.
Oh, let's be generous: Let's take the
1000 richest US citizens and assume that
each of the 600 least wealthy are also
each worth
$1.55 billion.
Then the total wealth of the 1000
wealthiest US citizens would be
2.29 * 10**12 + 600 * 1.55 * 10**9 =
3,220,000,000,000
dollars, that is, about 3.2 trillion
dollars.
Suppose we outright 'confiscate' and
'redistribute' all this wealth across all
US citizens. So, from Google search
"US population"
we see that the US population in 2014 was
318.9 million
people.
If we were just to confiscate the full
$3,220,000,000,000
and redistribute it among the
318.9 million
people, then from the 'redistribution'
each person would get
3,220,000,000,000 / ( 318.9 * 10**6 )
= 10,097.21
dollars, that is about 10 thousand
dollars.
So, that's what each person would get if
we were to do a 'full redistribution' of
the wealth of the 1000 wealthiest US
citizens.
So, right, $10,097.21 per person is not
enough for a yacht, a house, a new car, or
one year of college.
And that $10,097.21 would be a one-time
thing, not each year.
So, where is the real 'wealth' for
individuals in the US? Sure, just where
it long has been: In (1) Social Security
obligations, (2) the rest of the US
'social safety net', and (3) employee
pension funds.
So, if want US citizens, including the
poorest, to be much richer, which is a
terrific goal, then, rather than
confiscate the wealth of the 1000
wealthiest, find a ways for more of the
318.9 million
people to have good jobs. Just how to do
that is more complicated than the simple
arithmetic used here.
- spo81rty 11y agoEvery time I read stuff about the 1% and income inequality I always think about the same exact logic that you outlined here. Splitting up the wealth of the top 1% and giving it to everyone else doesn't even make much of a dramatic difference to them. I agree there are stats that show CEO pay is at an all time high. Minimum wage adjusted for inflation is not as high as it once was either. I also think we have to solve this problem by creating better and better jobs. Paying the high school kid who takes movie tickets in Seattle a $15 an hour minimum wage is not the long term solution. We need more well paying skilled jobs.
- notahacker 11y ago> Splitting up the wealth of the top 1% and giving it to everyone else doesn't even make much of a dramatic difference to them. If it was remotely feasible to confiscate the wealth of the top 1% and redistribute it, there would be enough nominal value to double the net worth (or halve the net debt) of the remaining 99% of people. That seems like a pretty dramatic difference to me. I agree there's a long list of reasons why we shouldn't attempt this, but top 1% don't actually have much to share around isn't one of them.
- graycat 11y agoI made a crude, "generous", estimate based on the 1000 richest and picked 1000 mostly because I was able to get the Forbes 400 data easily. For your 1%, we'd need some data on how much money they have. Do you have some data for us?
- graycat 11y agoOr, take a 1% person and assume they have $100 million and we redistribute all of it. Then we would be giving that to the other 99 people, call it 100, i.e., include the (formerly) 1% person. Then each person would get $1 million, once. But for the middle class, really want a job at $100,000 a year for 40 years, that is, $4 million. So the $1 million is only 25% of the way there. For the poor people, we still need to find the other 75%, that is, $3 million.
- 11y ago