4 ms·

Equipment. So far most of the US gear goes to ISIS. You'd think I'd be over-exaggerating, but just last weekend US equipment (eg Humvees) that went to the Shia

by seivan 11y ago

Equipment. So far most of the US gear goes to ISIS. You'd think I'd be over-exaggerating, but just last weekend US equipment (eg Humvees) that went to the Shia militia also known as Iraq "army" (ISF) was left while back while they abandoned Ramadi so ISIS could get in. Not the first time the Iraqi "army" does that. The Peshmerga desperately need Anti-Tank/IED gear. So far they are relying on MILANs from Germany. They have enough trained soldiers and experienced soldiers from old wars to tackle ISIS, but they are working with some really old weapons. I've seen snipers using old ww2 rifles. No joke. From what I understand there is a bill at congress (pushed by the Republicans) to arm the Peshmerga (Kurdistan) directly instead of relying on Baghdad (HAH!) to give the the kurds their 10% share. Not sure if it has passed yet. Essentially the Iraqi "Army" has failed, the only thing that is stable in Iraq is the "Gold Division", essentially their Special Forces. They are pretty effective at holding ISIS at bay, but have endured heavy casualties because of the Militia/Army incompetence. The Shia militia can't hold their grounds... except when it comes to abusing Sunni civilians. Iraq doesn't exist anymore. It's now Iran... the US is arming Iran 😂. Let that sink in.

ajmurmann 11y ago
That sounds to me like Equipment is not what's needed, since there is hardly anyone reliable we can give the equipment to. How about deploying a few millions soldiers? A few million sounds like a unreasonably large number, but on the other hand there were 4 million soldiers in Stalingrad alone and we should be able to treat this situation as urgently as things were handled in WWII. To me ISIS is right up there with the Nazis. So let's go all out and get this done with!
- rdl 11y ago
  The Kurds, at least in Iraq, have consistently been friends of the US, and at least compared to the other states in the region, a basically progressive and moderate government. (There are issues with Turkey and Iran w.r.t. Kurds in those countries as well as with the idea of Kurdistan, since it would potentially redraw their own borders.) Aside from some very specialized troops (combat controllers and maybe some other SOF; high level logistics people to interface with the rest of the supply chain; some trainers and advisors) you could probably equip the Kurdish forces with modern weapons to good effect. The biggest issue is bypassing the Iraqi central government basically admits that Iraq is/was/will always be a failure, and guarantees it. This might cause both Iran and KSA to intervene in the territory. This could lead to escalation; I'd personally be willing to accept the status quo in Syria if the alternative is a regional war.
  - comrade1 11y ago
    The Kurds may be friends with the u.s. but the u.s. has not been friends with the Kurds. Our relationship with nato ally turkey has taken precedence and we've turned a blind eye to terrible actions by turkey against the Kurds.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
  - fapjacks 11y ago
    Your last paragraph is prophetic and extremely salient.
- angersock 11y ago
  To me ISIS is right up there with the Nazis. So let's go all out and get this done with! You know, it was only when really forced to deal with things that we intervened with the Nazis. They were decent business partners otherwise.
- nemo 11y ago
  "we should be able to treat this situation as urgently as things were handled in WWII." The US went into WW II because of Pearl Harbor. We didn't go in after Hitler had invaded most of Europe. We did send war supplies but didn't send troops. The urgency was when Japan committed a formal and very humiliating act of war. So that's probably not a great example of the US treating things with urgency. ISIS is odious, but given that we create the conditions for their existence due to previous rash military action, it would be wise to get a proper multilateral response with a full commitment and some actual hope to actually manage the aftermath with some chance of not having another horrifying group fill the power vacuum once we've stopped bombing. Realistically it's a hideous situation where if we grind ISIS into the dirt, we'll be elevating Iran's power in the region even more when we already got rid of Saddam's regime and replaced him with an Iranian puppet.
jkestner 11y ago
Turkey would also really not like it if we armed the Kurds.
- peteretep 11y ago
  Perhaps Turkey could funnel some of that dislike in to making their Southern Border a little less permeable?
  - waps 11y ago
    Turkey is ruled by what a number of people call a Sunni extremist, who has, for example, on occasion said he wants the position of caliph. The way he sells himself to Turkey's population is fundamentally religious in nature. He has pushed through some of islam's sexist laws, disadvantaging women, ... They will not be a reliable ally against ISIS.
stevenjohns 11y ago
Enough of your worthless rhetoric. I blocked you on Twitter because of your constant racism and ridiculous ultranationalism, and tried very hard to ignore you when you spoke on this subject before. What annoys me isn't that you're lying - this is something that comes natural to you - but that people on HN who are usually not susceptible to such empty claims don't seem to be voting you down into the ground. 1. The Iraqi army is not Shiite, it is overwhelmingly Sunni and especially in places like Ramadi. This extends to the upper military command as well[0], including the Minister of Defense. 2. The Peshmerga have more than enough weapons and have been given all the weapons they could handle. What you should be more concerned about is the Kurdistan Democratic Party refusing to arm the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan Peshmerga, and arresting Yezidis (the people that ultranationalists such as yourself exploit) who try to seek arms from the Iraqi central government. 3.The bill pushed at congress has nothing to do with arming the Peshmerga, it instead has to do with violating Iraq's sovereignty (which Sunni politicians, including the governor of Anbar[1] and Iraqi separatists[2], are against), arming American-vetted militias independently and without the approval or consultation of the Iraqi government, and also refusing to arm the Iraqi government on the basis that it is exclusionary. This is all based on the fantasy that your type (the liars, the ultranationalists, the sectarianists) try to sell to the uninformed that Iraq is not providing arms to non-Shiites, which is a blatant lie. Baghdad is providing more than enough arms to every group in Iraq, and any honest observer of Iraq has the same conclusion. The Sunni forces from Ramadi also argue that the local government (read: democratically elected Sunni representatives) were witholding weapons and ammunition, of which there is plenty[3]. This includes Reidar Visser, a Norwegian historian of Iraq commenting that what the republicans are seeking is essentially a restoration of a Sunni dictatorship[4]. 4. The Iraqi army has not failed. The liberation of Diyala, the liberation of Samarra, the liberation of the Baghdad belts, the liberation of various areas in Salahideen, and so on. 5. Any area the Shiite militias have entered has been held, including Diyala, Baghdad belts, various parts of Anbar, Tikrit, and so on. There has been no abuse of Sunni civilians that can be attributed to anything other than isolated incidents, and it is the Sunni civilians and politicians who call for the Shiite militias to enter their areas and provinces. Unlike yourself, it seems that outside of the Kurdish nationalists and ISIS supporters, the Iraqi people are not racist or sectarianists. 6. Iraq does exist. It is not Iran, and neither the Iraqis or Iranians want it to be that way. The US is not arming Iran, so stop with your nonsense. There is an Iranian part of Iraq, it is called Kurdistan. This is where much of the economy is dependent on Iran, the locals are an Iranic people, speak an Iranian language, and the majority of their arms come from Iran. The problem with you ultranationalists is that while trying to make yourself victims, you come across as the most vile, oppressive, racist and overwhelmingly sectarian idiots in the region. Keep your lies to Twitter, stop trying to force it to spill into places like Hacker News. Edit: and just for full disclosure, I am an Iraqi-born Mandaean[5] whose entire ethnoreligious group (save for a few hundred people) has been robbed, killed and ethnically cleansed from Iraq. I am not Christian, I am not Shiite, I am not Sunni, I am not an Assyrian, I am not an Arab, I am not a Kurd, I own no land in Iraq and have no role to play in Iraqi politics. [0] https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599199851079933953 https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599199851079933953, https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599448705012506624 https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599448705012506624, https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599449216474288128 https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599449216474288128 [1] https://twitter.com/Sohaib_Alrawi/status/592754103358464001 https://twitter.com/Sohaib_Alrawi/status/592754103358464001 [2] https://twitter.com/reidarvisser/status/594467244224155649 https://twitter.com/reidarvisser/status/594467244224155649 [3] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mt0opjDXgTc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mt0opjDXgTc [4] https://twitter.com/reidarvisser/status/593493534696673280 https://twitter.com/reidarvisser/status/593493534696673280 [5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandaeans http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandaeans

by seivan 11y ago

ajmurmann 11y ago

That sounds to me like Equipment is not what's needed, since there is hardly anyone reliable we can give the equipment to. How about deploying a few millions soldiers? A few million sounds like a unreasonably large number, but on the other hand there were 4 million soldiers in Stalingrad alone and we should be able to treat this situation as urgently as things were handled in WWII. To me ISIS is right up there with the Nazis. So let's go all out and get this done with!

rdl 11y ago
The Kurds, at least in Iraq, have consistently been friends of the US, and at least compared to the other states in the region, a basically progressive and moderate government. (There are issues with Turkey and Iran w.r.t. Kurds in those countries as well as with the idea of Kurdistan, since it would potentially redraw their own borders.) Aside from some very specialized troops (combat controllers and maybe some other SOF; high level logistics people to interface with the rest of the supply chain; some trainers and advisors) you could probably equip the Kurdish forces with modern weapons to good effect. The biggest issue is bypassing the Iraqi central government basically admits that Iraq is/was/will always be a failure, and guarantees it. This might cause both Iran and KSA to intervene in the territory. This could lead to escalation; I'd personally be willing to accept the status quo in Syria if the alternative is a regional war.
- comrade1 11y ago
  The Kurds may be friends with the u.s. but the u.s. has not been friends with the Kurds. Our relationship with nato ally turkey has taken precedence and we've turned a blind eye to terrible actions by turkey against the Kurds.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- fapjacks 11y ago
  Your last paragraph is prophetic and extremely salient.
angersock 11y ago
To me ISIS is right up there with the Nazis. So let's go all out and get this done with! You know, it was only when really forced to deal with things that we intervened with the Nazis. They were decent business partners otherwise.
nemo 11y ago
"we should be able to treat this situation as urgently as things were handled in WWII." The US went into WW II because of Pearl Harbor. We didn't go in after Hitler had invaded most of Europe. We did send war supplies but didn't send troops. The urgency was when Japan committed a formal and very humiliating act of war. So that's probably not a great example of the US treating things with urgency. ISIS is odious, but given that we create the conditions for their existence due to previous rash military action, it would be wise to get a proper multilateral response with a full commitment and some actual hope to actually manage the aftermath with some chance of not having another horrifying group fill the power vacuum once we've stopped bombing. Realistically it's a hideous situation where if we grind ISIS into the dirt, we'll be elevating Iran's power in the region even more when we already got rid of Saddam's regime and replaced him with an Iranian puppet.

jkestner 11y ago

Turkey would also really not like it if we armed the Kurds.

peteretep 11y ago
Perhaps Turkey could funnel some of that dislike in to making their Southern Border a little less permeable?
- waps 11y ago
  Turkey is ruled by what a number of people call a Sunni extremist, who has, for example, on occasion said he wants the position of caliph. The way he sells himself to Turkey's population is fundamentally religious in nature. He has pushed through some of islam's sexist laws, disadvantaging women, ... They will not be a reliable ally against ISIS.

stevenjohns 11y ago

Enough of your worthless rhetoric. I blocked you on Twitter because of your constant racism and ridiculous ultranationalism, and tried very hard to ignore you when you spoke on this subject before. What annoys me isn't that you're lying - this is something that comes natural to you - but that people on HN who are usually not susceptible to such empty claims don't seem to be voting you down into the ground. 1. The Iraqi army is not Shiite, it is overwhelmingly Sunni and especially in places like Ramadi. This extends to the upper military command as well[0], including the Minister of Defense. 2. The Peshmerga have more than enough weapons and have been given all the weapons they could handle. What you should be more concerned about is the Kurdistan Democratic Party refusing to arm the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan Peshmerga, and arresting Yezidis (the people that ultranationalists such as yourself exploit) who try to seek arms from the Iraqi central government. 3.The bill pushed at congress has nothing to do with arming the Peshmerga, it instead has to do with violating Iraq's sovereignty (which Sunni politicians, including the governor of Anbar[1] and Iraqi separatists[2], are against), arming American-vetted militias independently and without the approval or consultation of the Iraqi government, and also refusing to arm the Iraqi government on the basis that it is exclusionary. This is all based on the fantasy that your type (the liars, the ultranationalists, the sectarianists) try to sell to the uninformed that Iraq is not providing arms to non-Shiites, which is a blatant lie. Baghdad is providing more than enough arms to every group in Iraq, and any honest observer of Iraq has the same conclusion. The Sunni forces from Ramadi also argue that the local government (read: democratically elected Sunni representatives) were witholding weapons and ammunition, of which there is plenty[3]. This includes Reidar Visser, a Norwegian historian of Iraq commenting that what the republicans are seeking is essentially a restoration of a Sunni dictatorship[4]. 4. The Iraqi army has not failed. The liberation of Diyala, the liberation of Samarra, the liberation of the Baghdad belts, the liberation of various areas in Salahideen, and so on. 5. Any area the Shiite militias have entered has been held, including Diyala, Baghdad belts, various parts of Anbar, Tikrit, and so on. There has been no abuse of Sunni civilians that can be attributed to anything other than isolated incidents, and it is the Sunni civilians and politicians who call for the Shiite militias to enter their areas and provinces. Unlike yourself, it seems that outside of the Kurdish nationalists and ISIS supporters, the Iraqi people are not racist or sectarianists. 6. Iraq does exist. It is not Iran, and neither the Iraqis or Iranians want it to be that way. The US is not arming Iran, so stop with your nonsense. There is an Iranian part of Iraq, it is called Kurdistan. This is where much of the economy is dependent on Iran, the locals are an Iranic people, speak an Iranian language, and the majority of their arms come from Iran. The problem with you ultranationalists is that while trying to make yourself victims, you come across as the most vile, oppressive, racist and overwhelmingly sectarian idiots in the region. Keep your lies to Twitter, stop trying to force it to spill into places like Hacker News. Edit: and just for full disclosure, I am an Iraqi-born Mandaean[5] whose entire ethnoreligious group (save for a few hundred people) has been robbed, killed and ethnically cleansed from Iraq. I am not Christian, I am not Shiite, I am not Sunni, I am not an Assyrian, I am not an Arab, I am not a Kurd, I own no land in Iraq and have no role to play in Iraqi politics. [0] https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599199851079933953 https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599199851079933953, https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599448705012506624 https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599448705012506624, https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599449216474288128 https://twitter.com/IAlsodani/status/599449216474288128 [1] https://twitter.com/Sohaib_Alrawi/status/592754103358464001 https://twitter.com/Sohaib_Alrawi/status/592754103358464001 [2] https://twitter.com/reidarvisser/status/594467244224155649 https://twitter.com/reidarvisser/status/594467244224155649 [3] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mt0opjDXgTc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mt0opjDXgTc [4] https://twitter.com/reidarvisser/status/593493534696673280 https://twitter.com/reidarvisser/status/593493534696673280 [5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandaeans http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandaeans