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Under normal circumstances I would consider the treatment of the SS soldiers described here war crimes. But the men of the SS were and are not deserving of the

by jonyt 11y ago

Under normal circumstances I would consider the treatment of the SS soldiers described here war crimes. But the men of the SS were and are not deserving of the protections normally granted to soldiers. For the atrocities that they committed only the most brutal punishment will suffice. My dad had a friend who as a partisan fought on the eastern front. Whenever they captured a German soldier they checked his armpit for the telltale tattoo. If he had it they would immediately run him over with a tank. I think that's the most kindly death they could expect in light of their heinous behavior.

tomsaffell 11y ago
Whether another human deserves to die (in a cruel and extrajudicial manner no less) is a judgement I hope never to have to make. To that end, I suspect I'd find "the protections normally granted to soldiers" to be entirely appropriate. That said, to stand in either man's shoes these seventy years later is an act of imagination beyond me. So in that sense, I accept my inability to judge either's actions.
glibgil 11y ago
> only the most brutal punishment will suffice Suffice for what? Only to make you feel better. This is some real magical-thinking torture porn. Nothing special happens when you kill a person one way versus another.
- JoeAltmaier 11y ago
  Nonsense. The survivors feel differently. That's very real.
  - glibgil 11y ago
    It's not "very real". If a survivor knew their captour was shot, run over by a tank, put in prison immediately or on the run for years, but eventually captured the survivor would feel about the same amount of resolution as their personality is disposed to synthesize. Nothing special happens in human consciousness if the resolution is extra gory.
    - themartorana 11y ago
      That is patently incorrect. If it were, horrific methods of execution would never be imagined or used as deterrent punishments throughout history. The method of execution can have a profound psychological impact on many different people in many different ways. Further, if there was no difference to a victim or survivor between imprisonment and execution, we wouldn't have a death penalty debate at all.
      - glibgil 11y ago
        > deterrent That's rich. Study up on human psychology. Death and other cruel punishments are not a deterrent.
- Spooky23 11y ago
  I'm not going to pretend to understand the feelings that went through the heads of the men mentioned here. But, I could certainly see how after witnessing and surviving a foreign army rampaging through my home, killing tens of thousands and seizing everything in sight one would develop an extreme distaste for the Germans. After surviving that, to witness the SS round up or simply murder the Jews, communist party officals (or amyone else for that matter) and engage in the rape & pillage and reprisal (ie. Kill any Russian in a 10:1 ratio as revenge for Germans killed by partisans) routine they were known for must have created a kind of rage that is difficult to contain or control. Its hard for me to imagine. But I think that it would be hard to let some SS guy live in that situation. Why should he live when so many didn't? Is that justice? There is little morality to be found in war, particularly one like WW2. As distasteful as it may be, I don't think you can judge these men with our civilian at peace moral perspective.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
seivan 11y ago
Reminds me of some of the scenes from the movie Fury. I see the same thing for ISIS-members. Read some of the refugee stories from Christian, Shia and Yezidis. The Yezidis got to suffer the brunt of it. Sweden decided to give immunity and apartments/jobs for returning ISIS member. The Sunni-lobby has done a tremendous job for themselves in Sweden under the shrouds of "feminism" and "anti-racism". Last meeting with the Swedish government, had NOT A SINGLE Shia-muslim representation. In my eyes, any single person who was even partially part of ISIS deserves lead surgically placed between their eyes.
aaron695 11y ago
I think you'd do well in the SS.

by jonyt 11y ago

tomsaffell 11y ago

Whether another human deserves to die (in a cruel and extrajudicial manner no less) is a judgement I hope never to have to make. To that end, I suspect I'd find "the protections normally granted to soldiers" to be entirely appropriate. That said, to stand in either man's shoes these seventy years later is an act of imagination beyond me. So in that sense, I accept my inability to judge either's actions.

glibgil 11y ago

> only the most brutal punishment will suffice Suffice for what? Only to make you feel better. This is some real magical-thinking torture porn. Nothing special happens when you kill a person one way versus another.

JoeAltmaier 11y ago
Nonsense. The survivors feel differently. That's very real.
- glibgil 11y ago
  It's not "very real". If a survivor knew their captour was shot, run over by a tank, put in prison immediately or on the run for years, but eventually captured the survivor would feel about the same amount of resolution as their personality is disposed to synthesize. Nothing special happens in human consciousness if the resolution is extra gory.
  - themartorana 11y ago
    That is patently incorrect. If it were, horrific methods of execution would never be imagined or used as deterrent punishments throughout history. The method of execution can have a profound psychological impact on many different people in many different ways. Further, if there was no difference to a victim or survivor between imprisonment and execution, we wouldn't have a death penalty debate at all.
    - glibgil 11y ago
      > deterrent That's rich. Study up on human psychology. Death and other cruel punishments are not a deterrent.
Spooky23 11y ago
I'm not going to pretend to understand the feelings that went through the heads of the men mentioned here. But, I could certainly see how after witnessing and surviving a foreign army rampaging through my home, killing tens of thousands and seizing everything in sight one would develop an extreme distaste for the Germans. After surviving that, to witness the SS round up or simply murder the Jews, communist party officals (or amyone else for that matter) and engage in the rape & pillage and reprisal (ie. Kill any Russian in a 10:1 ratio as revenge for Germans killed by partisans) routine they were known for must have created a kind of rage that is difficult to contain or control. Its hard for me to imagine. But I think that it would be hard to let some SS guy live in that situation. Why should he live when so many didn't? Is that justice? There is little morality to be found in war, particularly one like WW2. As distasteful as it may be, I don't think you can judge these men with our civilian at peace moral perspective.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

seivan 11y ago

Reminds me of some of the scenes from the movie Fury. I see the same thing for ISIS-members. Read some of the refugee stories from Christian, Shia and Yezidis. The Yezidis got to suffer the brunt of it. Sweden decided to give immunity and apartments/jobs for returning ISIS member. The Sunni-lobby has done a tremendous job for themselves in Sweden under the shrouds of "feminism" and "anti-racism". Last meeting with the Swedish government, had NOT A SINGLE Shia-muslim representation. In my eyes, any single person who was even partially part of ISIS deserves lead surgically placed between their eyes.

aaron695 11y ago

I think you'd do well in the SS.