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I spend my time around a lot of feminist circles, and I would say that most feminists don't believe this. They would suggest that economic dependency should be

I spend my time around a lot of feminist circles, and I would say that most feminists don't believe this. They would suggest that economic dependency should be a choice, and if so, there is a viable alternative for them if that choice ends up not working out. Personally I think the reasonable argument would be that women should be able to reach the same status as men in the article if they choose to do so, without the socioeconomic barriers to entry that they will inevitably face in the process. If women in society have absolutely no choice but to depend on men economically, then that's where the problem is.

htns 11y ago
Equality of choice is just one kind of equality. The trick is to pick between choice and outcome equality as it benefits you the most.
caseysoftware 11y ago
I think you're wrong on this one. @FemFreq heavily promoted this article on Twitter (getting 512 RTs and 780+ favorites): https://theconversation.com/no-feminism-is-not-about-choice-40896 https://theconversation.com/no-feminism-is-not-about-choice-... which includes this quote: "In the book, which I co-edited, 20 of us take on different topics that have become part of the “choice feminism” landscape: from pornography and prostitution, to female genital mutilation, from women’s magazines and marriage, to sexual violence. While coming from a range of different perspectives, we all critique the notion that “choice” should be the ultimate arbiter of women’s freedom." The TLDR version: there are no real choices for women as they're limited by their status in society, etc. The idea of "choice" is comical to them. If "most feminists" believe choice is the key freedom, they better speak out or risk being drowned out.
- vacri 11y ago
  Your own quote shows that this tweet is a fringe attack against a theme in feminism - it is a counter against 'choice feminism'. It's clearly a statement by a edge concept against a central theme. >If "most feminists" believe choice is the key freedom, they better speak out or risk being drowned out. Indeed, also in your link is the quote (in only the second paragraph): "Read almost any online article about feminism and the comments will soon devolve into a debate about choice.". It seems that the feminists are already doing what you're demanding, but you're... ahem... choosing to ignore them to make your point. Anyway, if you read the article, it says the same thing that your quoted section does - that choice itself isn't bad, but that it should stop being used as the 'ultimate arbiter', including examples where the author considers 'but it's her choice' to be undermining feminism. She doesn't say 'choice' is bad, but her argument is to stop having 'choice' used as a trump card.
- facepalm 11y ago
  Simone de Beauvoir, famous feminist thinker, said that no woman should be allowed to stay at home with her children because it would be too easy and comfortable. (quoted from memory, not sure about the exact words).

htns 11y ago

Equality of choice is just one kind of equality. The trick is to pick between choice and outcome equality as it benefits you the most.

caseysoftware 11y ago

I think you're wrong on this one. @FemFreq heavily promoted this article on Twitter (getting 512 RTs and 780+ favorites): https://theconversation.com/no-feminism-is-not-about-choice-40896 https://theconversation.com/no-feminism-is-not-about-choice-... which includes this quote: "In the book, which I co-edited, 20 of us take on different topics that have become part of the “choice feminism” landscape: from pornography and prostitution, to female genital mutilation, from women’s magazines and marriage, to sexual violence. While coming from a range of different perspectives, we all critique the notion that “choice” should be the ultimate arbiter of women’s freedom." The TLDR version: there are no real choices for women as they're limited by their status in society, etc. The idea of "choice" is comical to them. If "most feminists" believe choice is the key freedom, they better speak out or risk being drowned out.

vacri 11y ago
Your own quote shows that this tweet is a fringe attack against a theme in feminism - it is a counter against 'choice feminism'. It's clearly a statement by a edge concept against a central theme. >If "most feminists" believe choice is the key freedom, they better speak out or risk being drowned out. Indeed, also in your link is the quote (in only the second paragraph): "Read almost any online article about feminism and the comments will soon devolve into a debate about choice.". It seems that the feminists are already doing what you're demanding, but you're... ahem... choosing to ignore them to make your point. Anyway, if you read the article, it says the same thing that your quoted section does - that choice itself isn't bad, but that it should stop being used as the 'ultimate arbiter', including examples where the author considers 'but it's her choice' to be undermining feminism. She doesn't say 'choice' is bad, but her argument is to stop having 'choice' used as a trump card.
facepalm 11y ago
Simone de Beauvoir, famous feminist thinker, said that no woman should be allowed to stay at home with her children because it would be too easy and comfortable. (quoted from memory, not sure about the exact words).