4 ms·

Teaching as a graduate student i'm seeing a pattern where my department is swamped with students and thus has a lot of grad students teaching (a lot of people h

by Rhapso 11y ago

Teaching as a graduate student i'm seeing a pattern where my department is swamped with students and thus has a lot of grad students teaching (a lot of people here on student visas), then then evaluates all the teaching grad students based on student reviews. A lot of those out-country students are scared of angering students, getting bad reviews and getting kicked out. End result, classes are getting easier and grades are inflating. Students are getting less prepared for later classes I'm a US citizen and I have a reputation for being a hard grader because my position is a lot more stable (it is a lot easier to get funding for US citizens). I teach mostly upper level classes and I am failing a lot of students with "good" grades.

woliveirajr 11y ago
Who ever read the "The Drunkard's Walk: How Randomness Rules Our Lives" might have some idea about how people are over-confident that they can judge something, or give grades, that are correct, unbiased, and so on... and how that is a big... hum... lie.
- Rhapso 11y ago
  That is the hardest part of teaching for me. After a semester of working with students. I am looking at a spreadsheet assigning them semi-arbitrary values. Grades are not fair. I give a lot of sub-grades on assignments and projects in an attempt to correct for error but I still don't feel great about the signal to noise ratio there. The only thing I grade on is an ability to communicate mastery, rather than mastery itself. There is not much I can do about that.
  - davidgrenier 11y ago
    Maybe I don't understand what you said... but I have a feeling introverts would get penalized? Have you read Quiet?
  - NhanH 11y ago
    I don't think anyone has ever solved the issue of "communicate mastery" vs "mastery" itself: in our field, that's pretty much why recruiting/ hiring/ interview is a big fat giant clusterfuck. Is it actually an issue with grad students worrying about being kicked out? That would be completely bizarre and unthinkable to me: I thought it would be at worst jeopardize the student's TA ship or some silly thing with quals.
    - Rhapso 11y ago
      If you are here from another country on student visa, your TA ship is what is keeping you here. Being a student is a condition of your visa and such a visa will not allow you to find general employment. If you lose funding you cannot afford to live and if you get a job you get deported. http://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/students-and-exchange-visitors/students-and-employment http://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/students-and-exch...
  - woliveirajr 11y ago
    That's a very good approach, and I'm glad that there are some teachers that have this knowledge.
  - Lawtonfogle 11y ago
    >The only thing I grade on is an ability to communicate mastery, rather than mastery itself. Is there really a difference? The brightest math genius, if he is unable to communicate his mastery in any way, is no better than the average individual. To me the problem seems to be that grading is based on communicating mastery in a highly artificial situation. How often is a programmer or scientist needing to work under the same conditions as on a test? How often is an engineer supposed to receive zero input from their peers before completing a design? How often does the average student need to know the 50 states and their capitals when looking it up is not an option?
    - Rhapso 11y ago
      Well, you seem to have demonstrated the difference pretty clearly in your answer (which indicates we are quibbling over terms) From my perspective "communicating mastery" is exactly what you describe. I am limited to the context and expectations of a classroom. So students being able to pass tests is at the root of "Communicating Mastery" whereas mastery itself would be the ability to do the job in "real life" The only solution I've found is to design tests and projects that focus on describing the process rather than the result. I give a lesson on "How to take a test in Computer Science" in every class I teach which is mostly about un-teaching them how to take tests. I tell them: - Every question is an essay question, even if you are suppose to pick from a list of answers. The only true multiple choice is a scantron test, which I don't give. - If a question is vague, either ask for clarification or even better: - make assumptions - be aware of those assumptions (this is really what I want to test for) - write them down as part of your answer - If there are many reasonable assumptions, enumerate them and if there is space and time, answer the question for each of them. I've had students answer a memorization question with: "The solution is to look this up" and given them full credit for a correct answer. The real problem at this point is not how a specific test is run, but rather that our education systems has trained students to think inside a very small box when taking tests, and students become often paralyzed with indecision when asked to act outside that box. Most of my students have never experienced socratic method, and are honestly scared of it.
      - Lawtonfogle 11y ago
Tloewald 11y ago
Assistant professors are in a similar position -- student evals influence tenure decisions. It's a fundamental problem of poorly designed incentives.
- Rhapso 11y ago
  No, the incentives are well designed, just not for the task we perceive as important. We want to produce competent and educated students. Colleges and Universities want to maximize throughput and income. _In the short term_, student reviews do that job.
  - Tloewald 11y ago
    Right -- universities are "diluting their brand" in the long term by creating incentives that destroy the value of college education.

by Rhapso 11y ago

woliveirajr 11y ago

Who ever read the "The Drunkard's Walk: How Randomness Rules Our Lives" might have some idea about how people are over-confident that they can judge something, or give grades, that are correct, unbiased, and so on... and how that is a big... hum... lie.

Rhapso 11y ago
That is the hardest part of teaching for me. After a semester of working with students. I am looking at a spreadsheet assigning them semi-arbitrary values. Grades are not fair. I give a lot of sub-grades on assignments and projects in an attempt to correct for error but I still don't feel great about the signal to noise ratio there. The only thing I grade on is an ability to communicate mastery, rather than mastery itself. There is not much I can do about that.
- davidgrenier 11y ago
  Maybe I don't understand what you said... but I have a feeling introverts would get penalized? Have you read Quiet?
- NhanH 11y ago
  I don't think anyone has ever solved the issue of "communicate mastery" vs "mastery" itself: in our field, that's pretty much why recruiting/ hiring/ interview is a big fat giant clusterfuck. Is it actually an issue with grad students worrying about being kicked out? That would be completely bizarre and unthinkable to me: I thought it would be at worst jeopardize the student's TA ship or some silly thing with quals.
  - Rhapso 11y ago
    If you are here from another country on student visa, your TA ship is what is keeping you here. Being a student is a condition of your visa and such a visa will not allow you to find general employment. If you lose funding you cannot afford to live and if you get a job you get deported. http://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/students-and-exchange-visitors/students-and-employment http://www.uscis.gov/working-united-states/students-and-exch...
- woliveirajr 11y ago
  That's a very good approach, and I'm glad that there are some teachers that have this knowledge.
- Lawtonfogle 11y ago
  >The only thing I grade on is an ability to communicate mastery, rather than mastery itself. Is there really a difference? The brightest math genius, if he is unable to communicate his mastery in any way, is no better than the average individual. To me the problem seems to be that grading is based on communicating mastery in a highly artificial situation. How often is a programmer or scientist needing to work under the same conditions as on a test? How often is an engineer supposed to receive zero input from their peers before completing a design? How often does the average student need to know the 50 states and their capitals when looking it up is not an option?
  - Rhapso 11y ago
    Well, you seem to have demonstrated the difference pretty clearly in your answer (which indicates we are quibbling over terms) From my perspective "communicating mastery" is exactly what you describe. I am limited to the context and expectations of a classroom. So students being able to pass tests is at the root of "Communicating Mastery" whereas mastery itself would be the ability to do the job in "real life" The only solution I've found is to design tests and projects that focus on describing the process rather than the result. I give a lesson on "How to take a test in Computer Science" in every class I teach which is mostly about un-teaching them how to take tests. I tell them: - Every question is an essay question, even if you are suppose to pick from a list of answers. The only true multiple choice is a scantron test, which I don't give. - If a question is vague, either ask for clarification or even better: - make assumptions - be aware of those assumptions (this is really what I want to test for) - write them down as part of your answer - If there are many reasonable assumptions, enumerate them and if there is space and time, answer the question for each of them. I've had students answer a memorization question with: "The solution is to look this up" and given them full credit for a correct answer. The real problem at this point is not how a specific test is run, but rather that our education systems has trained students to think inside a very small box when taking tests, and students become often paralyzed with indecision when asked to act outside that box. Most of my students have never experienced socratic method, and are honestly scared of it.
    - Lawtonfogle 11y ago

Tloewald 11y ago

Assistant professors are in a similar position -- student evals influence tenure decisions. It's a fundamental problem of poorly designed incentives.

Rhapso 11y ago
No, the incentives are well designed, just not for the task we perceive as important. We want to produce competent and educated students. Colleges and Universities want to maximize throughput and income. _In the short term_, student reviews do that job.
- Tloewald 11y ago
  Right -- universities are "diluting their brand" in the long term by creating incentives that destroy the value of college education.