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I want to hear the argument about people who want to drive. I enjoy driving. I like driving cars. I still drive a manual and will not buy an automatic transmis

• wwkeyboard 11y ago
  People still ride horses and we've had cars for over 100 years. I don't see driving going away, it just might be constrained in when and where you are allowed to drive(maybe like Autobahn in Chicago and Motorsports Ranch in Houston).
• JshWright 11y ago
  Pretty easy to s/cars/guns/g and s/driving/shooting/g in your comment and I think you may have a reasonable idea what the future holds...
• calvin_c 11y ago
  I think it's perfectly acceptable to expect that the enthusiasts will be the ones to preserve the things they love that fall out of favor. I enjoy driving on a nice empty road as well, but I don't think it's something that "need[s] to be preserved." It's something we have to do that we've learned to enjoy and do more than we need to. If it stops being something we have to do it's up to us to make time to do it for pleasure.
• trequartista 11y ago
  Driving isn't going to go anywhere, but I can see driving being "penalized" via exorbitant insurance rates - so much so that the it probably might offset the cost of buying a manually driven car. It'll probably end up being a hobby, albeit an expensive one.
  • jcromartie 11y ago
    Wouldn't insurance rates just go down in general? Car insurance would be incredibly streamlined with self-driving cars.
• sorenbs 11y ago
  It will probably be more expensive to insure a self-driven car but I don't se it being banned outright. It will be a luxury, a sport.
• nazgulnarsil 11y ago
  I want to hear the argument about people who want to ride. I enjoy riding. I like riding horses. I still ride a horse and will not buy an automobile. I participate in riding clubs and I compete in horse racing events. I enjoy horse photography and I do my own hoof maintenance on my steeds. What happens to people like me who actually enjoy riding and the act of owning a horse? Do my loves get phased out because the majority of people just think of transportation as appliances? Will this give birth to "classic-riding shows"? Not saying I don't like innovation, I'd absolutely love to own a model-T, but some things need to be preserved.
  • NovaS1X 11y ago
    Didn't think of the horse perspective. Thanks for that. Still feels bad that some I love doing every day will be regulated to somewhere far removed from where I live and done only a few times a month at best.
    • bkeroack 11y ago
      I doubt it will be outlawed. You can still ride horses on public streets in most places (probably not freeways I imagine), but most people of course don't. In the same way you probably will be able to drive cars manually indefinitely, even while most will choose to use autonomous vehicles.
      • daeken 11y ago
        It won't be outlawed; it'll just be priced out of existence. When autos are good enough, insurance costs for manual driving will skyrocket. Only the very richest will be able to afford driving on roads.
        • BHSPitMonkey 11y ago
          That doesn't seem to follow. Insuring a manual driver wouldn't carry any more risk than it does today (on the contrary, there may even be fewer payouts due to other drivers being replaced with safer autonomous counterparts).
• cmelbye 11y ago
  You mentioned cars as appliances, but you forgot the part where humans driving cars has cause of millions of deaths and many more injuries. I expect it will still be possible to drive cars manually, but in dedicated or isolated areas.
• pat2man 11y ago
  People love to fly but not everyone should be a pilot. Same goes with driving. The driving test could get more vigorous and you might not be able to drive on all roads but you will still be able to drive.
• kmano8 11y ago
  From a sentimental perspective, I hear you. I've also enjoyed driving, taking care of my car, etc. That said, the idea that some things need to be preserved isn't going to keep human-driven cars in the mainstream if the world wants to go in a different direction. Take a look at newspapers -- I have no fewer than 5 relatives bemoaning the collapse of physical newspapers. Because nostalgia. It's decidedly more efficient to get your news electronically. How long before The Times discontinues home delivery? Even if (when?) self-driving cars become the majority, I think you'll still see hobbyist avenues for enjoying cars -- with, my guess is, higher expense to you and a lot more regulation on use (e.g. not allowed to drive in cities?).
  • agumonkey 11y ago
    I have an issue with the efficiency argument. Far too often when things driven by efficiency reach a certain 'point', the density of effort put into it plummets and so does quality (food, music, ...). I'm biased toward old, non automated way of doing things, because people do care about the craft/art and that's where the value is. I'd run a mile to buy a newspaper if the journalists are worth it. Sure, these industry don't thrive like they used to when the underlying tech was the best or only one, but that's a hard fact of nature.
• jcromartie 11y ago
  Self-driving cars will still have manual controls, for all of the minutiae at the beginning and end of a trip (mostly to do with parking).
  • benkuykendall 11y ago
    Does the Google car not do parking?
    • jcromartie 11y ago
      Navigating places like parking lots, drive-thrus, garages, driveways, off-road, etc., gets pretty arbitrary. There's not much a self-driving car could even do for you, so manual controls will always be necessary.
      • deskamess 11y ago
        I suspect passengers will be dropped off and the car will take itself to an automated parking lot. Likely pull onto a platform and get parked in a dense vertical 'parking farm'. Alternatively it could be put in 'rental mode' for x hours. However if it is a taxi, it will likely go on to its next fare.
  • davmre 11y ago
    Parking is one of the easiest and most valuable things to automate; it's finicky and humans basically suck at it. Self-driving cars may have manual controls but it probably won't be driven by parking.
• tdees40 11y ago
  I wonder if there will come a day when you can still drive your car, but you'll have to pay exorbitant insurance rates. That seems like a reasonable midpoint.
• anigbrowl 11y ago
  Rent time on a track pr a private road. You can have all the excitement you want, and if you crash there's no risk to the rest of the public.
• TulliusCicero 11y ago
  > Do my loves get phased out because the majority of people just think of cars as appliances? Oh, you'll still be able to drive, alright. On private roads designated for those who want to take their life into their own hands. For regular, public roads, your love of driving will take a backseat to others' love of continuing to be alive and uninjured.
• redbeard0x0a 11y ago
  Manual driven cars will not disappear, what will happen is Insurance will go through the roof as more self-driving cars are added to the roads. There will be some roads declared for self-driven cars only and some that will allow both. Enjoy your cars now!
  • NovaS1X 11y ago
    I see this being the most plausible thing to happen. Separate insurance classes for manual and automatic cars, the costs of each being supported by their perspective groups. However that begs the question: by sheer numbers would that make insurance on a automatic car comparable to a manually driven one? If there are significantly less manual cars, there are less accidents to pay out. An accident in a manual car is not a guarantee just like no accidents in automatic cars is not a guarantee. I think if manual insurance was more expensive it would be an artificial premium based on the fear of something happening.
    • dragonwriter 11y ago
      > However that begs the question: by sheer numbers would that make insurance on a automatic car comparable to a manually driven one? If there are significantly less manual cars, there are less accidents to pay out. But less to spread the cost over. Moreover, insurance rates aren't set at just enough to cover the average expected cost (which would result in, over any given time period, a 50% chance of the insurance company losing money) but enough above that that the insurance company is fairly certain that it will not lose money -- because of the law of large numbers, this will (for any given minimum probability of profitability) be closer to the expected cost when there are large numbers to spread the risk over, and farther (above) that expected cost when there are smaller numbers. So, smaller numbers of manual cars will -- all other things being equal -- drive up the costs of insuring manual cars if they are a separate risk pool from automatic cars.
  • EvanKelly 11y ago
    I haven't thought about how this affects car insurance. Who has the liability for collisions? Manufacturer? Owner? Last mechanic who serviced it?
• jmilloy 11y ago
  Your only argument seems to be that people should be allowed to do/have things that they like. I don't think this a very strong argument. We can come up a long list of things that people like(d) are no longer allowed because they are considered too harmful.
• shkkmo 11y ago
  I agree in that I hope that ability for people to drive cars will go not away completely. Driving can be a pleasure and a rush. I do hope that we would start holding drivers legally responsible for the deaths and injuries they cause. If you choose to drive a car yourself and you cause an accident that kills someone, then you should face a manslaughter charge. If you hit or injure someone, that should be an assault charge. I think it is ridiculous that this currently is not the case.
• brc 11y ago
  Most likely driving tests will be tightened and be made more difficult to pass. The main barrier to doin this right now is that so many people need to drive. It doesn't need to be spelled out that crashes are not evenly distributed between the driving population, and taking the 20% worst drivers off the road is going to reduce crashes by 80%. My insurance rates are low because of a very good driving history despite owning high powered cars. I don't see any reasons why that would change.
• castell 11y ago
  I enjoy driving, but I dislike rush hour traffic / traffic jams. Self-driving cars would be great to drive to the workplace and back home. But on weekend I want to drive myself on lonely scenic roads.