5 ms·

I'm an Ubuntu Linux and OS X user and have been trying to like Windows 8.1 in the last weeks. The problems I have in no particular order ... - network manageme

I'm an Ubuntu Linux and OS X user and have been trying to like Windows 8.1 in the last weeks. The problems I have in no particular order ... - network management in Windows 7 was usable, whereas in 8.1 it is totally fucked - Microsoft accounts are on their way to become mandatory, as creating a regular account is not user friendly and there's a big and scary warning when you go that route; they are basically trying to resurrect Windows Live ID - Microsoft has started to force people on using their products - I could not figure out a way to turn OneDrive off completely, or to use anything other than Bing as the search engine in their "Search Everywhere" (this also happens on Windows Phone) - I haven't seen a "modern Windows" app that I like, they are all pieces of crap, including stuff from Microsoft; modern Skype for example is lacking crucial functionality; their app store is filled with trademark-violating malware and I've never seen such a low quality app store - from a usability perspective Windows 8 is a failure - there's something inherently different about a PC with 21 inch monitors, keyboard and mouse, versus a tablet, yet Windows tries to unify both worlds, becoming hostile in the process - see this funny video on the subject - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTYet-qf1jo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTYet-qf1jo - of course, you can totally ignore the "modern Windows" side of the coin for now, except that's where Windows is headed - I bought the standard edition, then I discovered that I needed the Pro version to get disk encryption or to connect to it through Remote Desktop; plus you need the Enterprise edition to make it boot from an USB stick - apparently Microsoft considers disk encryption and Remote Desktop to be meant for businesses and not for personal usage - for software developers Cygwin is the only thing that makes Windows tolerable and Cygwin is awful The only thing that Windows is good for is for playing games. I'm only keeping it around for playing Heroes of M&M 3 (the classic one) and Path of Exile. And every time I try Windows, I end up appreciating just how awesome Linux is.

mark_l_watson 12y ago
Thank you! That was a good answer. Just one thing: OneDrive works well, if I may, I suggest giving it a try. Re: software development: I just live inIntelliJ for Clojure, Ruby, Java, JavaScript, Typescript, Clojurescript, and Python. IntelliJ runs about the same on every platform. I write my books now with markdown and leanpub, so for writing also operating system choice does not matter. True confession: I tend to cycle slowly through OSX, Linux, and Windows 8.1 because I like a little change. Similar to programming languages. My strange way to have fun :-)
- kijin 12y ago
  Does OneDrive work well with half a million files taking up half a TB of space across multiple devices? Last time I tried it, I could never be sure when my files had synched. OneDrive would just spin in the background, not even using much CPU or network bandwidth, and with no indication of what the hell it was doing, while the file I just edited remained unsynched for hours. For a product that wanted people to give it the entire content of their hard drives, OneDrive was woefully inadequate at handling large amounts of data. I ended up copying files manually to the device where I needed them to be, relegating OneDrive to the role of an eventually consistent backup. When my (paid) subscription was up, I canceled it and never used it again. Now I'm much happier with a 1TB plan at SpiderOak.
  - seanp2k2 12y ago
    I've tried BTSync, Syncthing, Dropbox, and rsync -avuz. The only thing which works consistently and doesn't take up 100% CPU for hours when working with many small files is rsync. Hopefully Syncthing will get there, but I wasn't impressed initially.
- lewisl9029 12y ago
  My experience with OneDrive has been downright abyssal. Even simple tasks like sync'ing a folder of torrents between my desktop and server for auto-watch somehow ends up failing in inexplicable ways. Such a shame too since they have the best pricing AFAIK. I wish they would just buy Dropbox, integrate it into Windows in place of OneDrive, and call it a day.
- sososoko 12y ago
  I love OneDrive, possiblt the best native synchronization tool out there, at least for Windows anyway. Mine does a funny thing though, whenever i git clone a repo into a folder in OneDrive it will crash. Does that ever happen to you?
  - chronolitus 12y ago
    I observed similar things, although not specifically when cloning
sesutton 12y ago
>- of course, you can totally ignore the "modern Windows" side of the coin for now, except that's where Windows is headed It seems to me that they are backing off metro/"modern Windows" more and more. 8.1 made boot to Desktop the default, they are bringing back the start menu in 10 and Metro apps will run in windows in 10.
- MichaelGG 12y ago
  Nope, they're going even more in with Win10. Calc.exe is replaced with a shitty, functionally inferior version that takes 1-2 seconds to start. The metroization is all over with its terrible blurry font rendering and gimped settings.
  - eropple 12y ago
    YMMV, but I can't tell the difference between the font rendering in Metro apps and WPF apps (on a Retina MacBook Pro). I really like the typeface and rendering choices they've made and it's easy for me to read.
    - MichaelGG 12y ago
      WPF apps also traditionally had shitty font rendering. The issue is that they are pixel unaware so at small sizes it blurs. On a HiDPI screen it's fine, as well as with larger font sizes. On the standard Windows DPI settings, it's terrible. Pixel snapping and ClearType are what deliver sharp small fonts at the cost of less "accuracy" since the renderer may need to bump things around by half a pixel or so. Some people don't care/notice or simply prefer the antialiased look. Up until Win 8/10, this was a choice at the system level, generally.
      - 72deluxe 12y ago
        I remember the good old days where they introduced that in XP (was it XP?) and suddenly all the fonts were blurry red/orange/black/green squishy messes that were impossible to read.
caf 12y ago
I thought Heroes of Might & Magic III was available for Linux anyway.
- spdionis 12y ago
  There is also an Android version of M&M III and M&M II.
- bad_user 12y ago
  I have an "HD version" from Steam that isn't available on Linux. Though I bet it's usable with Wine. Path of Exile is a tricky one though, as it is more recent - BTW, if you loved Diablo 2, but hate Diablo 3, then try Path of Exile. It's very good and free of charge too - it's a pity that it runs on Windows only, but the company producing it is small, so I don't blame them.
hvidgaard 12y ago
I'm an Arch, OS X, and Windows user. I'm a developer in my day job, on the .net platform. I prefer Arch any day of the week, but I really like windows as well. > network management in Windows 7 was usable, whereas in 8.1 it is totally fucked I have zero problems with network management. It has not changed how you do it from the CLI, and the GUI is just different. If your definition of "totally fucked" includes "new GUI", then I'm not sure what to say. I agree that it's a step back from Windows 7, but saying it's totally fucked is downright wrong. > Microsoft accounts are on their way to become mandatory, as creating a regular account is not user friendly and there's a big and scary warning when you go that route; they are basically trying to resurrect Windows Live ID I was throughly against the Microsoft ID to start with, but for other reasons I had to get one and since I use multiple PCs it has actually been a positive experience for me. I see that as a good thing, and if you don't like it you can still create a local account. The warning is fair, because a lot of the new functionality depend on the MSID. > Microsoft has started to force people on using their products - I could not figure out a way to turn OneDrive off completely Nobody is forcing you to use OneDrive, it's a feature and if you don't like it don't use it. Simple as that. You either do not use a MSID as your login or disable it as this (http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/onedrive/wiki/sdinstall-sduninstalling/how-to-completely-disable-onedrive/b97a8336-62e7-476c-872c-3286c0a01cf6 http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/onedrive/wiki/sdinstall-s...) MS article instructs. Just because you cannot remove an integral part of the OS because you don't like it, doesn't mean it's bad. It actually benefits a lot of people. > or to use anything other than Bing as the search engine in their "Search Everywhere" (this also happens on Windows Phone) And? Of course they want you to use Bing and not a competitor - I'm sure you'd be just as outraged if they offered a version of windows without bing for an extra cost. > I haven't seen a "modern Windows" app that I like, they are all pieces of crap, including stuff from Microsoft; modern Skype for example is lacking crucial functionality; their app store is filled with trademark-violating malware and I've never seen such a low quality app store Valid points. MS needs to step up their game, and developers need to take the Windows Store more serious. > from a usability perspective Windows 8 is a failure - there's something inherently different about a PC with 21 inch monitors, keyboard and mouse, versus a tablet, yet Windows tries to unify both worlds, becoming hostile in the process - see this funny video on the subject - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTYet-qf1jo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTYet-qf1jo That simply is not true (that is a failure). The video is just a circlejerk full of hyperbole and the last 1m40s contains the essence of it. It was really hard to take it seriously. Yes the forced "Metro UI" was not good for desktop, fortunately it just meant an extra mouse click and it's gone. That is it, and MS even admitted it improved it a lot with 8.1 and Windows 10 is even more of an improvement as a result. > of course, you can totally ignore the "modern Windows" side of the coin for now, except that's where Windows is headed You obviously haven't really looked at the changes from 8 -> 8.1 -> 10, because they've, A: admitted that it was poor UI, B: toned it down a lot and committed to making it a good UI instead. > I bought the standard edition, then I discovered that I needed the Pro version to get disk encryption or to connect to it through Remote Desktop; plus you need the Enterprise edition to make it boot from an USB stick - apparently Microsoft considers disk encryption and Remote Desktop to be meant for businesses and not for personal usage Oh, so you didn't actually research what the different versions contain, you just assume it and somehow it's MS fault? Don't get me wrong, I think RPD server, and full disk encryption should be part of the standard edition, but that's a different talk.

mark_l_watson 12y ago

Thank you! That was a good answer. Just one thing: OneDrive works well, if I may, I suggest giving it a try. Re: software development: I just live inIntelliJ for Clojure, Ruby, Java, JavaScript, Typescript, Clojurescript, and Python. IntelliJ runs about the same on every platform. I write my books now with markdown and leanpub, so for writing also operating system choice does not matter. True confession: I tend to cycle slowly through OSX, Linux, and Windows 8.1 because I like a little change. Similar to programming languages. My strange way to have fun :-)

kijin 12y ago
Does OneDrive work well with half a million files taking up half a TB of space across multiple devices? Last time I tried it, I could never be sure when my files had synched. OneDrive would just spin in the background, not even using much CPU or network bandwidth, and with no indication of what the hell it was doing, while the file I just edited remained unsynched for hours. For a product that wanted people to give it the entire content of their hard drives, OneDrive was woefully inadequate at handling large amounts of data. I ended up copying files manually to the device where I needed them to be, relegating OneDrive to the role of an eventually consistent backup. When my (paid) subscription was up, I canceled it and never used it again. Now I'm much happier with a 1TB plan at SpiderOak.
- seanp2k2 12y ago
  I've tried BTSync, Syncthing, Dropbox, and rsync -avuz. The only thing which works consistently and doesn't take up 100% CPU for hours when working with many small files is rsync. Hopefully Syncthing will get there, but I wasn't impressed initially.
lewisl9029 12y ago
My experience with OneDrive has been downright abyssal. Even simple tasks like sync'ing a folder of torrents between my desktop and server for auto-watch somehow ends up failing in inexplicable ways. Such a shame too since they have the best pricing AFAIK. I wish they would just buy Dropbox, integrate it into Windows in place of OneDrive, and call it a day.
sososoko 12y ago
I love OneDrive, possiblt the best native synchronization tool out there, at least for Windows anyway. Mine does a funny thing though, whenever i git clone a repo into a folder in OneDrive it will crash. Does that ever happen to you?
- chronolitus 12y ago
  I observed similar things, although not specifically when cloning

sesutton 12y ago

>- of course, you can totally ignore the "modern Windows" side of the coin for now, except that's where Windows is headed It seems to me that they are backing off metro/"modern Windows" more and more. 8.1 made boot to Desktop the default, they are bringing back the start menu in 10 and Metro apps will run in windows in 10.

MichaelGG 12y ago
Nope, they're going even more in with Win10. Calc.exe is replaced with a shitty, functionally inferior version that takes 1-2 seconds to start. The metroization is all over with its terrible blurry font rendering and gimped settings.
- eropple 12y ago
  YMMV, but I can't tell the difference between the font rendering in Metro apps and WPF apps (on a Retina MacBook Pro). I really like the typeface and rendering choices they've made and it's easy for me to read.
  - MichaelGG 12y ago
    WPF apps also traditionally had shitty font rendering. The issue is that they are pixel unaware so at small sizes it blurs. On a HiDPI screen it's fine, as well as with larger font sizes. On the standard Windows DPI settings, it's terrible. Pixel snapping and ClearType are what deliver sharp small fonts at the cost of less "accuracy" since the renderer may need to bump things around by half a pixel or so. Some people don't care/notice or simply prefer the antialiased look. Up until Win 8/10, this was a choice at the system level, generally.
    - 72deluxe 12y ago
      I remember the good old days where they introduced that in XP (was it XP?) and suddenly all the fonts were blurry red/orange/black/green squishy messes that were impossible to read.

caf 12y ago

I thought Heroes of Might & Magic III was available for Linux anyway.

spdionis 12y ago
There is also an Android version of M&M III and M&M II.
bad_user 12y ago
I have an "HD version" from Steam that isn't available on Linux. Though I bet it's usable with Wine. Path of Exile is a tricky one though, as it is more recent - BTW, if you loved Diablo 2, but hate Diablo 3, then try Path of Exile. It's very good and free of charge too - it's a pity that it runs on Windows only, but the company producing it is small, so I don't blame them.

hvidgaard 12y ago

I'm an Arch, OS X, and Windows user. I'm a developer in my day job, on the .net platform. I prefer Arch any day of the week, but I really like windows as well. > network management in Windows 7 was usable, whereas in 8.1 it is totally fucked I have zero problems with network management. It has not changed how you do it from the CLI, and the GUI is just different. If your definition of "totally fucked" includes "new GUI", then I'm not sure what to say. I agree that it's a step back from Windows 7, but saying it's totally fucked is downright wrong. > Microsoft accounts are on their way to become mandatory, as creating a regular account is not user friendly and there's a big and scary warning when you go that route; they are basically trying to resurrect Windows Live ID I was throughly against the Microsoft ID to start with, but for other reasons I had to get one and since I use multiple PCs it has actually been a positive experience for me. I see that as a good thing, and if you don't like it you can still create a local account. The warning is fair, because a lot of the new functionality depend on the MSID. > Microsoft has started to force people on using their products - I could not figure out a way to turn OneDrive off completely Nobody is forcing you to use OneDrive, it's a feature and if you don't like it don't use it. Simple as that. You either do not use a MSID as your login or disable it as this (http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/onedrive/wiki/sdinstall-sduninstalling/how-to-completely-disable-onedrive/b97a8336-62e7-476c-872c-3286c0a01cf6 http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/onedrive/wiki/sdinstall-s...) MS article instructs. Just because you cannot remove an integral part of the OS because you don't like it, doesn't mean it's bad. It actually benefits a lot of people. > or to use anything other than Bing as the search engine in their "Search Everywhere" (this also happens on Windows Phone) And? Of course they want you to use Bing and not a competitor - I'm sure you'd be just as outraged if they offered a version of windows without bing for an extra cost. > I haven't seen a "modern Windows" app that I like, they are all pieces of crap, including stuff from Microsoft; modern Skype for example is lacking crucial functionality; their app store is filled with trademark-violating malware and I've never seen such a low quality app store Valid points. MS needs to step up their game, and developers need to take the Windows Store more serious. > from a usability perspective Windows 8 is a failure - there's something inherently different about a PC with 21 inch monitors, keyboard and mouse, versus a tablet, yet Windows tries to unify both worlds, becoming hostile in the process - see this funny video on the subject - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTYet-qf1jo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTYet-qf1jo That simply is not true (that is a failure). The video is just a circlejerk full of hyperbole and the last 1m40s contains the essence of it. It was really hard to take it seriously. Yes the forced "Metro UI" was not good for desktop, fortunately it just meant an extra mouse click and it's gone. That is it, and MS even admitted it improved it a lot with 8.1 and Windows 10 is even more of an improvement as a result. > of course, you can totally ignore the "modern Windows" side of the coin for now, except that's where Windows is headed You obviously haven't really looked at the changes from 8 -> 8.1 -> 10, because they've, A: admitted that it was poor UI, B: toned it down a lot and committed to making it a good UI instead. > I bought the standard edition, then I discovered that I needed the Pro version to get disk encryption or to connect to it through Remote Desktop; plus you need the Enterprise edition to make it boot from an USB stick - apparently Microsoft considers disk encryption and Remote Desktop to be meant for businesses and not for personal usage Oh, so you didn't actually research what the different versions contain, you just assume it and somehow it's MS fault? Don't get me wrong, I think RPD server, and full disk encryption should be part of the standard edition, but that's a different talk.