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Should companies be run or managed by engineers? I'm not sure that's actually a good idea as much as I'm not overly fond of MBA types either. I think it's a fa

by mhomde 11y ago

Should companies be run or managed by engineers? I'm not sure that's actually a good idea as much as I'm not overly fond of MBA types either. I think it's a faulty generalization either way, companies should be run by competent passionate people.

trcollinson 11y ago
The reason a comment like that particularly stung at HP was that for the first 50+ years HP was rather successfully run by Bill Hewlett (Masters of Electrical Engineering at MIT), and Dave Packard (Masters of Electrical Engineering at Stanford). A lot of the people high up at HP while Carly was CEO remember fond lunches and dinner parties with Dave and Bill, they were quite active in the company. I agree that MBAs aren't a bad thing, and HP had many for a lot of years before Carly. But I would argue that it's exceptionally hard to change a company culture so drastically. And it can he detrimental to the organization as a whole.
- mhomde 11y ago
  Yeah I agree, HP had a very engineer centric culture and history so that must have been hard. I guess the dream of a company is always to find those unicorns that are both Engineer/MBA/Leader/Designers etc. In the end business people can be competent, but people with domain knowledge can be visionary (Scully vs Jobs for example)
Zombieball 11y ago
My impression has always been that many MBA folks were engineers to start with. A lot of MBA programs are structured to teach business acumen to folks that didn't take a 4 year business / commerce degree to start with.
- toyg 11y ago
  > My impression has always been that many MBA folks were engineers to start with. You were very lucky in your meetings with MBAs. > A lot of MBA programs are structured to teach business acumen to folks that didn't take a 4 year business / commerce degree to start with.. Yeah, and in most cases they didn't take a 4 year engineering degree either.
  - Zombieball 11y ago
    So what you are saying is... fine arts major + MBA = recipe for success!
MrBuddyCasino 11y ago
I can only speak about the german car industry, and over here, every manufacturer is lead by an engineer. Let that sink in for a minute. Ferdinand Piëch said in his autobiography: "[The leader] must have a technical background, as a development- or production technician. He has to have an integral (not quickly acquired) passion for cars and be able to think ten years ahead. The technical foundation is required in order to develop the necessary phantasy." I think the "develop the necessary phantasy" is the interesting part, as I think this matches Steve Job's approach, too. No engineer could bullshit him, because he knew exactly what was possible. He knew when it was possible to build the iPhone, when the RIM CEOs didn't even believe it when it was revealed to the world.
- asddubs 11y ago
  I was always under the impression that Steve Jobs did not have much of a technical background
  - MrBuddyCasino 11y ago
    After realizing he could always make a living as a halfway decent engineer while working for Atari, he just chose a different path. Maybe seeing Woz in action helped him make that decision.

by mhomde 11y ago

trcollinson 11y ago

The reason a comment like that particularly stung at HP was that for the first 50+ years HP was rather successfully run by Bill Hewlett (Masters of Electrical Engineering at MIT), and Dave Packard (Masters of Electrical Engineering at Stanford). A lot of the people high up at HP while Carly was CEO remember fond lunches and dinner parties with Dave and Bill, they were quite active in the company. I agree that MBAs aren't a bad thing, and HP had many for a lot of years before Carly. But I would argue that it's exceptionally hard to change a company culture so drastically. And it can he detrimental to the organization as a whole.

mhomde 11y ago
Yeah I agree, HP had a very engineer centric culture and history so that must have been hard. I guess the dream of a company is always to find those unicorns that are both Engineer/MBA/Leader/Designers etc. In the end business people can be competent, but people with domain knowledge can be visionary (Scully vs Jobs for example)

Zombieball 11y ago

My impression has always been that many MBA folks were engineers to start with. A lot of MBA programs are structured to teach business acumen to folks that didn't take a 4 year business / commerce degree to start with.

toyg 11y ago
> My impression has always been that many MBA folks were engineers to start with. You were very lucky in your meetings with MBAs. > A lot of MBA programs are structured to teach business acumen to folks that didn't take a 4 year business / commerce degree to start with.. Yeah, and in most cases they didn't take a 4 year engineering degree either.
- Zombieball 11y ago
  So what you are saying is... fine arts major + MBA = recipe for success!

MrBuddyCasino 11y ago

I can only speak about the german car industry, and over here, every manufacturer is lead by an engineer. Let that sink in for a minute. Ferdinand Piëch said in his autobiography: "[The leader] must have a technical background, as a development- or production technician. He has to have an integral (not quickly acquired) passion for cars and be able to think ten years ahead. The technical foundation is required in order to develop the necessary phantasy." I think the "develop the necessary phantasy" is the interesting part, as I think this matches Steve Job's approach, too. No engineer could bullshit him, because he knew exactly what was possible. He knew when it was possible to build the iPhone, when the RIM CEOs didn't even believe it when it was revealed to the world.

asddubs 11y ago
I was always under the impression that Steve Jobs did not have much of a technical background
- MrBuddyCasino 11y ago
  After realizing he could always make a living as a halfway decent engineer while working for Atari, he just chose a different path. Maybe seeing Woz in action helped him make that decision.