75 ms·

Please, someone tell me this is fucking illegal. I find these outbursts of genuine surprise and bewilderment amusing, in the best possible way. What I'm about

Please, someone tell me this is fucking illegal. I find these outbursts of genuine surprise and bewilderment amusing, in the best possible way. What I'm about to suggest is not meant to remedy or suggest alternate remedies to the workings of the criminal justice system as it currently operates. I'm merely expressing amusement at the colossal unfamiliarity of most of the generally law-abiding public (Black, White, Hispanic or otherwise) at how poorly our system works, even with the best intentions of the law makers and policy wonks. I can't but find people who expect an uniform carriage of justice, across all wealth levels, across all demographics and in all instances of law-breaking, to be nothing short of, deranged. Not so long ago, I held such similar delusions of equality and fairness, albeit not to the same degree as some here on HN. I always knew there was more than a little truth to the adage that it is far better to be wealthy and guilty than poor and innocent, in America. Any speck of doubt cleared up after I sat in a courtroom to witness the pre-trial consultations of a high profile defendant in SF. In a criminal case. It was a farce, to put it mildly. Just the resources available to the prosecutor on one side and the defendant with his high powered legal team -- which came with their own personal scribe to document the exchanges in the court, a videographer and the partner of the law firm among others -- on the other side, settled the matter for me. I don't quite know if its standard courtroom protocol to call both the parties - the prosecutor and the defendant's attorney - into recess to discuss matters in the judge's quarters but I counted 7 such times they just left to talk behind closed doors. I was floored at the deference with which the judge spoke to the defendant. The whole thing seemed like some closed door Congressional testimony with ranking members. I've never seen anything like it although I've seen the inside of a courtroom in unrelated matters before. I've seen common folk arraigned before. This was something else. And mind you this was in proletariat-loving SF not some courthouse in Montgomery, Alabama or Angola, Louisiana. I don't know what one should expect in those places. Try it sometime. Go to a courthouse and sit in one of the air-conditioned courtrooms and observe the proceedings. Edit: see comment below. Thx refurb.

eru 11y ago
> I can't but find people who expect an uniform carriage of justice, across all wealth levels, across all demographics and in all instances of law-breaking, to be nothing short of deranged. To be honest, the US is particularly bad in that regard.
- task_queue 11y ago
  When I think of other tiered justice systems I'm reminded of third world countries where things are literally two-tiered. Suddenly that picture of a luxury condominium overlooking a favela is less hyperbole and more of an accurate depiction of what we're doing over here.
refurb 11y ago
I'm confused. Why would a trial have a public defender and a high priced defense attorney? Did you mean prosecutor?
mschuster91 11y ago
> I find these outbursts of genuine surprise and bewilderment amusing, in the best possible way. > What I'm about to suggest is not meant to remedy or suggest alternate remedies to the workings of the criminal justice system as it currently operates. > I'm merely expressing amusement at the colossal unfamiliarity of most of the generally law-abiding public ( Black, White, Hispanic or otherwise ) at how poorly our system works, even with the best intentions of the law makers and policy wonks. > I can't but find people who expect an uniform carriage of justice, across all wealth levels, across all demographics and in all instances of law-breaking, to be nothing short of deranged. tbh, I'm German and while we have our own issues with police, conduct like this is next to unheard of. I have thought of the police tactics shown in e.g. NCIS (shouting at people until they confess, tricking them into confessions, ...) as typical Hollywood exaggerations, but apparently I was blatantly wrong.
- ceejayoz 11y ago
  > I have thought of the police tactics shown in e.g. NCIS (shouting at people until they confess, tricking them into confessions, ...) as typical Hollywood exaggerations, but apparently I was blatantly wrong. If anything, what you see on shows like NCIS are a romanticized, sanitized, whitewashed version of what really happens.
- saboot 11y ago
  > tbh, I'm German and while we have our own issues with police, conduct like this is next to unheard of. Can I be a german please? I'm just about serious at this point.
  - bjelkeman-again 11y ago
    If you work in IT I am sure it can be arranged. It will take a bit of time though. Get a job with a EU based company (in the Schengen agreement), but in their local office to you. Work for a couple of years there. Then get a transfer to one of their EU offices. Work there for a number of years. Apply for citizenship. The process is of course more complicated than that and dependent in which country you pick, but that is the general gist of it. But do your research. Although I would personally recommend that you stay where you are and join a movement to change your country.

eru 11y ago

> I can't but find people who expect an uniform carriage of justice, across all wealth levels, across all demographics and in all instances of law-breaking, to be nothing short of deranged. To be honest, the US is particularly bad in that regard.

task_queue 11y ago
When I think of other tiered justice systems I'm reminded of third world countries where things are literally two-tiered. Suddenly that picture of a luxury condominium overlooking a favela is less hyperbole and more of an accurate depiction of what we're doing over here.

refurb 11y ago

I'm confused. Why would a trial have a public defender and a high priced defense attorney? Did you mean prosecutor?

mschuster91 11y ago

> I find these outbursts of genuine surprise and bewilderment amusing, in the best possible way. > What I'm about to suggest is not meant to remedy or suggest alternate remedies to the workings of the criminal justice system as it currently operates. > I'm merely expressing amusement at the colossal unfamiliarity of most of the generally law-abiding public ( Black, White, Hispanic or otherwise ) at how poorly our system works, even with the best intentions of the law makers and policy wonks. > I can't but find people who expect an uniform carriage of justice, across all wealth levels, across all demographics and in all instances of law-breaking, to be nothing short of deranged. tbh, I'm German and while we have our own issues with police, conduct like this is next to unheard of. I have thought of the police tactics shown in e.g. NCIS (shouting at people until they confess, tricking them into confessions, ...) as typical Hollywood exaggerations, but apparently I was blatantly wrong.

ceejayoz 11y ago
> I have thought of the police tactics shown in e.g. NCIS (shouting at people until they confess, tricking them into confessions, ...) as typical Hollywood exaggerations, but apparently I was blatantly wrong. If anything, what you see on shows like NCIS are a romanticized, sanitized, whitewashed version of what really happens.
saboot 11y ago
> tbh, I'm German and while we have our own issues with police, conduct like this is next to unheard of. Can I be a german please? I'm just about serious at this point.
- bjelkeman-again 11y ago
  If you work in IT I am sure it can be arranged. It will take a bit of time though. Get a job with a EU based company (in the Schengen agreement), but in their local office to you. Work for a couple of years there. Then get a transfer to one of their EU offices. Work there for a number of years. Apply for citizenship. The process is of course more complicated than that and dependent in which country you pick, but that is the general gist of it. But do your research. Although I would personally recommend that you stay where you are and join a movement to change your country.