4 ms·

> I'm surprised they don't also cite the first war > against drugs Being a British publication, presumably they'd consider the Opium Wars - where the Brit

> I'm surprised they don't also cite the first war > against drugs Being a British publication, presumably they'd consider the Opium Wars - where the Brits fought to be allowed to sell the Chinese junk - as the first drug war.

chippy 12y ago
That was a war for drugs, rather than against them. It was also about fighting for another drug - tea. Tea and coffee also had quite a loud vocal support for prohibition against it in the UK.
- a8da6b0c91d 12y ago
  Several Asian countries very successfully waged "war" on opium usage, to the benefit of their societies. They killed you if you were caught with any. I'm not a prohibitionist, but we need to drop the lie that a war on drugs has even been tried in the West. Sentences for drug possession are typically avoidable and usually light. What has been done (same as back in alcohol prohibition days) is corrupt law enforcement rackets have been funded to pursue "dealers." Well, we know that doesn't work. What does work is very harsh and uniform punishment for users. Which, I reiterate, has not been tried in the West for over a century.
  - wavefunction 12y ago
    I think you're not being accurate when you claim that a "war on drugs" has not been prosecuted in the West. The cost to minority populations in the US and in countries where the drugs are produced has been enormous. Maybe you don't personally know anyone who has faced societally-imposed hardships due to drugs but the reality faced by many poor and minority people is quite stark and different than what you allege. A young man here in Texas was facing LIFE in prison for selling marijuana infused brownies (as well as possession of cannabis oils). That's just one case. And this: >>What does work is very harsh and uniform punishment for users. Paints you as a complete fool like the rest of the drug warriors.
- peteretep 12y ago
  > That was a war for drugs Not for the Chinese it wasn't
hackerboos 12y ago
Growing opium in India to sell to the Chinese. They objected to their citizens becoming addicts (rightly so) so the British empire and East India Trading company turned their gunships on them and seized Hong Kong under the Treaty of Nanking. The Chinese, outgunned, had to surrender the terms. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Opium_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Opium_War
- pstuart 12y ago
  And the British have demonstrated how well they handle alcohol these days. Edit: meow, oh the butthurt. Binge drinking apparently is a significant problem but is tolerated because "alcohol is not a drug" http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10825449/Britains-binge-drinking-levels-are-among-the-highest-in-the-world.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10825449/Britain...
jahewson 12y ago
I don't know about that; it was a war for a legalised drug trade rather than against it. It's notable that the Chinese tried to enforce a total ban on the trade and to execute domestic traders, which resembles modern (failing) drug policy. The similarities probably end there though, as modern drug cartels and the British Empire are very different entities. It's also worth remembering that America was selling opium to China too, and that John Quincy Adams spoke in favour of the opium wars from a "free trade" stance.

chippy 12y ago

That was a war for drugs, rather than against them. It was also about fighting for another drug - tea. Tea and coffee also had quite a loud vocal support for prohibition against it in the UK.

a8da6b0c91d 12y ago
Several Asian countries very successfully waged "war" on opium usage, to the benefit of their societies. They killed you if you were caught with any. I'm not a prohibitionist, but we need to drop the lie that a war on drugs has even been tried in the West. Sentences for drug possession are typically avoidable and usually light. What has been done (same as back in alcohol prohibition days) is corrupt law enforcement rackets have been funded to pursue "dealers." Well, we know that doesn't work. What does work is very harsh and uniform punishment for users. Which, I reiterate, has not been tried in the West for over a century.
- wavefunction 12y ago
  I think you're not being accurate when you claim that a "war on drugs" has not been prosecuted in the West. The cost to minority populations in the US and in countries where the drugs are produced has been enormous. Maybe you don't personally know anyone who has faced societally-imposed hardships due to drugs but the reality faced by many poor and minority people is quite stark and different than what you allege. A young man here in Texas was facing LIFE in prison for selling marijuana infused brownies (as well as possession of cannabis oils). That's just one case. And this: >>What does work is very harsh and uniform punishment for users. Paints you as a complete fool like the rest of the drug warriors.
peteretep 12y ago
> That was a war for drugs Not for the Chinese it wasn't

hackerboos 12y ago

Growing opium in India to sell to the Chinese. They objected to their citizens becoming addicts (rightly so) so the British empire and East India Trading company turned their gunships on them and seized Hong Kong under the Treaty of Nanking. The Chinese, outgunned, had to surrender the terms. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Opium_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Opium_War

pstuart 12y ago
And the British have demonstrated how well they handle alcohol these days. Edit: meow, oh the butthurt. Binge drinking apparently is a significant problem but is tolerated because "alcohol is not a drug" http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10825449/Britains-binge-drinking-levels-are-among-the-highest-in-the-world.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10825449/Britain...

jahewson 12y ago

I don't know about that; it was a war for a legalised drug trade rather than against it. It's notable that the Chinese tried to enforce a total ban on the trade and to execute domestic traders, which resembles modern (failing) drug policy. The similarities probably end there though, as modern drug cartels and the British Empire are very different entities. It's also worth remembering that America was selling opium to China too, and that John Quincy Adams spoke in favour of the opium wars from a "free trade" stance.