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Define cultured? Say you're an average European. Hop into your (rented) car and drive 4 hours in any linear direction? Who are you going to see? Chances are som

Define cultured? Say you're an average European. Hop into your (rented) car and drive 4 hours in any linear direction? Who are you going to see? Chances are someone from a different culture and history and probably one who once warred with you. I jump in my car and drive 4 hours, I'm at my state capital. I drive another 4 hours, I'm in Georgia. America is a huge country. We were the EU before unioning was cool. The "countries" (states) we interact with are all the same. Nothing but Sun Glass Huts and McDonalds coast to coast. Does that make us uncultured? No, it makes us so cultured that we can get along with 25% of the worlds economy. Just some historical things to think about.

CWuestefeld 12y ago
I take your point. Last fall we drove for 8 hours, from Austin, TX to Big Bend National Park. We'd have to drive several more hours before leaving the state. On the other hand, there are many subcultures in America. Just going from an urban environment to the countryside will yield a big difference in the perspective of those living there. And having just recently moved to TX from the East Coast, I also now realize a marked tendency of those on the coast to ignore the fact that the country covers 4 time zones. Today I'm booked in meetings from 12-2, as east coasters overlook the fact that my lunch schedule is an hour off their own.
lfowles 12y ago
> probably one who once warred with you On the other hand, in the US if I drive 4 hours south, I'm firmly in Confederate states.
- virmundi 12y ago
  You are, but you're still fundamentally in the US. The system of government is the same, the general ideas are the same. Heck, most of the people that fought in the South weren't really pro-slavery as anti-federalist. Anti-federalist isn't original to the those states, Jefferson, the 3rd president, was anti-federalist. Even more to the point it was a civil war. Most Brits can drive around and find that. Heck, they might just have to cross the street for that.
cbd1984 12y ago
> Nothing but Sun Glass Huts and McDonalds coast to coast. This is so amazingly wrong I don't know where to begin.
- virmundi 12y ago
  The point is that we have, at a macro level, a common, homogenous culture. We have a common language, shared history, and shared cultural context.
  - cbd1984 12y ago
    > The point is that we have, at a macro level, a common, homogenous culture. Only if you focus on the mass-marketed commercial culture, which reduces your argument to a basic tautology: "We have a shared mass-market commercial culture, therefore we have a shared mass-market commercial culture." Guess what: Europe has a shared mass-market commercial culture, too, and it's partially the same one America has. If you can go from Maine to New Mexico without noticing any change in the local culture, I posit that you must be not only blind but deaf and lacking an olfactory sense as well. > We have a common language, shared history, and shared cultural context. We have a language with multiple dialects, a history which is only shared by those who are not recent immigrants (otherwise the concept of "shared history" loses all meaning), and to the extent a shared cultural context makes sense, that changes based on generation and, yes, region. There is a certain American cultural context which is shared by most Americans. Sure. However, it isn't as homogeneous as you make it out to be, and it certainly isn't focused entirely on mass-market commercial culture, as you seemed to imply.
    - virmundi 12y ago
      I've lived across the various parts of the country. I've never been confused if I'm still in America. I've been through New York. They'll say things like, "Going way up there, eh?" But I still know I'm in the US and not Canada. Drive in New Mexico, there are points that just looking at the landscape, you might think you wandered into Old Mexico. As soon as you hit town there is an American feel; even along border cities. Never have I been unsure that I'm in Canada. Crossing from Detroit to Canada feels like I'm in Canada. The country has a feel. I bet that there are few Europeans that are unsure they are in a different country. Again to reference the Brits, moving within the UK still can feel like being a different country ('cause you are). That's what makes the argument that Europeans are so cultured humorous to me. They are cultured in the sense that they have to be. An Italian in a major city HAS TO BE aware of the German ethos. They don't have to like it, they don't have to speak the language, but the feeling is there regardless. America is "uncultured" because Europeans don't realize that we are cultured, it's just that we're versed in a gigantic culture that they will not match for at least 100 years while the EU (if it does) solidifies.

CWuestefeld 12y ago

I take your point. Last fall we drove for 8 hours, from Austin, TX to Big Bend National Park. We'd have to drive several more hours before leaving the state. On the other hand, there are many subcultures in America. Just going from an urban environment to the countryside will yield a big difference in the perspective of those living there. And having just recently moved to TX from the East Coast, I also now realize a marked tendency of those on the coast to ignore the fact that the country covers 4 time zones. Today I'm booked in meetings from 12-2, as east coasters overlook the fact that my lunch schedule is an hour off their own.

lfowles 12y ago

> probably one who once warred with you On the other hand, in the US if I drive 4 hours south, I'm firmly in Confederate states.

virmundi 12y ago
You are, but you're still fundamentally in the US. The system of government is the same, the general ideas are the same. Heck, most of the people that fought in the South weren't really pro-slavery as anti-federalist. Anti-federalist isn't original to the those states, Jefferson, the 3rd president, was anti-federalist. Even more to the point it was a civil war. Most Brits can drive around and find that. Heck, they might just have to cross the street for that.

cbd1984 12y ago

> Nothing but Sun Glass Huts and McDonalds coast to coast. This is so amazingly wrong I don't know where to begin.

virmundi 12y ago
The point is that we have, at a macro level, a common, homogenous culture. We have a common language, shared history, and shared cultural context.
- cbd1984 12y ago
  > The point is that we have, at a macro level, a common, homogenous culture. Only if you focus on the mass-marketed commercial culture, which reduces your argument to a basic tautology: "We have a shared mass-market commercial culture, therefore we have a shared mass-market commercial culture." Guess what: Europe has a shared mass-market commercial culture, too, and it's partially the same one America has. If you can go from Maine to New Mexico without noticing any change in the local culture, I posit that you must be not only blind but deaf and lacking an olfactory sense as well. > We have a common language, shared history, and shared cultural context. We have a language with multiple dialects, a history which is only shared by those who are not recent immigrants (otherwise the concept of "shared history" loses all meaning), and to the extent a shared cultural context makes sense, that changes based on generation and, yes, region. There is a certain American cultural context which is shared by most Americans. Sure. However, it isn't as homogeneous as you make it out to be, and it certainly isn't focused entirely on mass-market commercial culture, as you seemed to imply.
  - virmundi 12y ago
    I've lived across the various parts of the country. I've never been confused if I'm still in America. I've been through New York. They'll say things like, "Going way up there, eh?" But I still know I'm in the US and not Canada. Drive in New Mexico, there are points that just looking at the landscape, you might think you wandered into Old Mexico. As soon as you hit town there is an American feel; even along border cities. Never have I been unsure that I'm in Canada. Crossing from Detroit to Canada feels like I'm in Canada. The country has a feel. I bet that there are few Europeans that are unsure they are in a different country. Again to reference the Brits, moving within the UK still can feel like being a different country ('cause you are). That's what makes the argument that Europeans are so cultured humorous to me. They are cultured in the sense that they have to be. An Italian in a major city HAS TO BE aware of the German ethos. They don't have to like it, they don't have to speak the language, but the feeling is there regardless. America is "uncultured" because Europeans don't realize that we are cultured, it's just that we're versed in a gigantic culture that they will not match for at least 100 years while the EU (if it does) solidifies.