3 ms·

exactly... one important property of cash is it is printed debt-free by the state, which can profit from the seigniorage this is the story of latter half of 2

exactly... one important property of cash is it is printed debt-free by the state, which can profit from the seigniorage this is the story of latter half of 20th Century, rise of credit cards and electronic transfers displacing cash in UK, 1946, fully 46% of the money supply was printed debt-free by the state (with the profit added to govt bottom line), now it is a pitiful 2-3% with a corresponding explosion in debt money http://www.positivemoney.org/2011/10/debt-free-money/ http://www.positivemoney.org/2011/10/debt-free-money/

nhaehnle 12y ago
> one important property of cash is it is printed debt-free by the state, which can profit from the seigniorage This is actually not true in current typical monetary systems. There may be exceptions, but the typical setup is that the central bank prints physical money solely as a reaction to demand by banks (who need it to stock their ATMs). From an asset point of view it is an entirely neutral operation that is irrelevant to the state's fiscal position. In some countries (including the US), coins are minted by the treasury and then sold to the central bank for distribution. In those countries, the state does profit from seignorage - but only of coins, so it tends to be irrelevant in practice (modulo the occasional amusing trillion dollar platinum coin debate).
pif 12y ago
Well, another fundamental property of cash is that it is anonymous, and this can be seen as wrong on many levels.
zhte415 12y ago
If money is either 'debt money' or 'non debt money' then a relative decrease in one would imply a relative increase in the other. The linked article is full of apples and oranges. 'debt free cash' from the article's seeming definition is M0. While 'non debt free cash' appears to imply M2 (or M4). They're not opposites, but products of each other. Cash simply passes around the economy much faster, instead of sitting under the mattress or in the draw of the accountant for the best part of a week before wages are paid, it sits in an ATM, efficiently on-demand for who needs it when they need it. The velocity of money (how fast it moves from one person's hand to another) has simply increased, substantially, due to technological improvements. Money * Velocity of Money = Read Economic Production * Inflation Rate The above is always true (which is why money supply is a good predictor of nominal growth (and on the assumption economic growth changes slowly, inflation, which can vary more, but that takes a qualitative judgment), as it is more accurately and in a more timely manner. 'Debt money', or M2, is more better compared to M2L, the corresponding side of the monetary balance sheet (balance sheets also being an identity: Assets = Liabilities + Capital). And M2 is a much more realistic of the concept of 'money' as it includes deposits and other short term bank liabilities. So compare that to M2L, not M0 to M2, apples to oranges, as M2 is a product of M0 and M0 velocity. Edit: The referenced article mentioned sterling. For similar definitions of money for the Euro or Dollar substitute M2 for M1, and M4 for M3.

nhaehnle 12y ago

> one important property of cash is it is printed debt-free by the state, which can profit from the seigniorage This is actually not true in current typical monetary systems. There may be exceptions, but the typical setup is that the central bank prints physical money solely as a reaction to demand by banks (who need it to stock their ATMs). From an asset point of view it is an entirely neutral operation that is irrelevant to the state's fiscal position. In some countries (including the US), coins are minted by the treasury and then sold to the central bank for distribution. In those countries, the state does profit from seignorage - but only of coins, so it tends to be irrelevant in practice (modulo the occasional amusing trillion dollar platinum coin debate).

pif 12y ago

Well, another fundamental property of cash is that it is anonymous, and this can be seen as wrong on many levels.

zhte415 12y ago

If money is either 'debt money' or 'non debt money' then a relative decrease in one would imply a relative increase in the other. The linked article is full of apples and oranges. 'debt free cash' from the article's seeming definition is M0. While 'non debt free cash' appears to imply M2 (or M4). They're not opposites, but products of each other. Cash simply passes around the economy much faster, instead of sitting under the mattress or in the draw of the accountant for the best part of a week before wages are paid, it sits in an ATM, efficiently on-demand for who needs it when they need it. The velocity of money (how fast it moves from one person's hand to another) has simply increased, substantially, due to technological improvements. Money * Velocity of Money = Read Economic Production * Inflation Rate The above is always true (which is why money supply is a good predictor of nominal growth (and on the assumption economic growth changes slowly, inflation, which can vary more, but that takes a qualitative judgment), as it is more accurately and in a more timely manner. 'Debt money', or M2, is more better compared to M2L, the corresponding side of the monetary balance sheet (balance sheets also being an identity: Assets = Liabilities + Capital). And M2 is a much more realistic of the concept of 'money' as it includes deposits and other short term bank liabilities. So compare that to M2L, not M0 to M2, apples to oranges, as M2 is a product of M0 and M0 velocity. Edit: The referenced article mentioned sterling. For similar definitions of money for the Euro or Dollar substitute M2 for M1, and M4 for M3.