7 ms·

This goes to show how the values of modern society are backwards. We see advertisements depicting happy people using a product and striving towards it means a

by corv 11y ago

This goes to show how the values of modern society are backwards. We see advertisements depicting happy people using a product and striving towards it means a stressful life of work. We covet status symbols that cause resentment in others. We meticulously create artificial impressions of us that we publish on social networks which ultimately detach us from real social ties that would strengthen us, provide meaning and make us happier. It takes awareness and courage to break free from such harmful habits when they are so ingrained throughout society.

collyw 11y ago
The Dali Lama has some wonderful quotes around such subjects: Man sacrifices his health in order to make money. Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health. Then he is so anxious about the future that he doesn't enjoy the present: the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived.
- steamy 11y ago
  You should thank capitalism for this.
- Luc 11y ago
  Well that is pretty judgmental, and doesn't sound like something the Dalai Lama would say. At least it's not a supposed Einstein quote for a change...
  - pavlov 11y ago
    Why do you feel it's judgemental? I read it as saying "there are people like this", which is certainly true in my opinion.
    - Luc 11y ago
      'Man' is mankind, so all of humanity. Anyway, Wikiquote concurs with my feeling about it being misattributed: http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenzin_Gyatso,_14th_Dalai_Lama#.22What_surprises_you_most_about_humanity.3F.22 http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenzin_Gyatso,_14th_Dalai_Lama#...
- agumonkey 11y ago
  I think Cartesianism is also linked to that. By optimizing desintegrated parts (of life) we miss the big picture.
- klodolph 11y ago
  This is an incorrect attribution. There is no record of the Dailai Lama saying that. Nor does it sound—even vaguely—like something he would say.
- kristofferR 11y ago
  http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenzin_Gyatso,_14th_Dalai_Lama#.22What_surprises_you_most_about_humanity.3F.22 http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenzin_Gyatso,_14th_Dalai_Lama#... "Often attributed to the Dalai Lama, or as author shanx dee, this appears to be a loose adaptation of the work of Jim Brown, published by Reata Strickland as An Interview with God (ISBN 0743229576)."
  - collyw 11y ago
    fair enough, I have seen it attributed to the Dali Lama many times
6d0debc071 11y ago
I don't know how many people actually behave in this manner. Most of the people I know who don't have a lot of money floating around seem to have some incredible expense aside from pure status symbols; children, drug habits, gambling addictions; or are in low-income jobs.
BringTheTanks 11y ago
One'd hope that the "values of modern society" have enough capacity to accommodate both ambition and relationships. Painting ambition in negative tone and putting too much focus on relationships causes the same myopia that focusing only on ambition does. It's never just one thing that matters.
- rayiner 11y ago
  I agree that more than one thing should matter, but our society is pretty hostile to that idea. Consider, for example, that for a large fraction of the population, marriage and kids are key relationships that will make them happy. Yet, we're the egg-freezing generation. We want kids, but we are also deeply afraid that having them will compromise our ability to compete.
  - pen2l 11y ago
    > I agree that more than one thing should matter, but our society is pretty hostile to that idea. Practically speaking our economy is more hostile to it than our society. It's just that it's really really hard to have marriage+kids in a nice neighborhood and compete at the same time; but by accounts people who can pull that off are considered winners. It seems to me the only answer is having a very progressive, socialist economy which makes the marriage+kids easier. (Another alternative is resetting societal values to be less materialistic, but that ain't happening -- men will always want BMWs and iphones, a lot of women would still want that diamond stone). Also, the egg-freezing scares the bejesus out of me. Someone pointed out in the thread about Chinese scientists tweaking human embryos that we know so little about things that while we may be thinking we've tweaked an embryo in a safe way, and a human is born of it, the really bad dysgenic properties may not be manifest until later in life. Egg-freezing stirs the same feelings in me. On a related note, one of my aunts is an ob/gyn doctor, and I've heard her say many times that for a very wide variety of reasons it is best that children be had earlier rather than later (20s instead of 30s, 30s instead of 40s, etc.) for both men and women (but especially women). I don't know what I'm getting at, I guess all I can say is, damn, we have it tough, I wish I knew of good answers.

by corv 11y ago

collyw 11y ago

The Dali Lama has some wonderful quotes around such subjects: Man sacrifices his health in order to make money. Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health. Then he is so anxious about the future that he doesn't enjoy the present: the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived.

steamy 11y ago
You should thank capitalism for this.
Luc 11y ago
Well that is pretty judgmental, and doesn't sound like something the Dalai Lama would say. At least it's not a supposed Einstein quote for a change...
- pavlov 11y ago
  Why do you feel it's judgemental? I read it as saying "there are people like this", which is certainly true in my opinion.
  - Luc 11y ago
    'Man' is mankind, so all of humanity. Anyway, Wikiquote concurs with my feeling about it being misattributed: http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenzin_Gyatso,_14th_Dalai_Lama#.22What_surprises_you_most_about_humanity.3F.22 http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenzin_Gyatso,_14th_Dalai_Lama#...
agumonkey 11y ago
I think Cartesianism is also linked to that. By optimizing desintegrated parts (of life) we miss the big picture.
klodolph 11y ago
This is an incorrect attribution. There is no record of the Dailai Lama saying that. Nor does it sound—even vaguely—like something he would say.
kristofferR 11y ago
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenzin_Gyatso,_14th_Dalai_Lama#.22What_surprises_you_most_about_humanity.3F.22 http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Tenzin_Gyatso,_14th_Dalai_Lama#... "Often attributed to the Dalai Lama, or as author shanx dee, this appears to be a loose adaptation of the work of Jim Brown, published by Reata Strickland as An Interview with God (ISBN 0743229576)."
- collyw 11y ago
  fair enough, I have seen it attributed to the Dali Lama many times

6d0debc071 11y ago

I don't know how many people actually behave in this manner. Most of the people I know who don't have a lot of money floating around seem to have some incredible expense aside from pure status symbols; children, drug habits, gambling addictions; or are in low-income jobs.

BringTheTanks 11y ago

One'd hope that the "values of modern society" have enough capacity to accommodate both ambition and relationships. Painting ambition in negative tone and putting too much focus on relationships causes the same myopia that focusing only on ambition does. It's never just one thing that matters.

rayiner 11y ago
I agree that more than one thing should matter, but our society is pretty hostile to that idea. Consider, for example, that for a large fraction of the population, marriage and kids are key relationships that will make them happy. Yet, we're the egg-freezing generation. We want kids, but we are also deeply afraid that having them will compromise our ability to compete.
- pen2l 11y ago
  > I agree that more than one thing should matter, but our society is pretty hostile to that idea. Practically speaking our economy is more hostile to it than our society. It's just that it's really really hard to have marriage+kids in a nice neighborhood and compete at the same time; but by accounts people who can pull that off are considered winners. It seems to me the only answer is having a very progressive, socialist economy which makes the marriage+kids easier. (Another alternative is resetting societal values to be less materialistic, but that ain't happening -- men will always want BMWs and iphones, a lot of women would still want that diamond stone). Also, the egg-freezing scares the bejesus out of me. Someone pointed out in the thread about Chinese scientists tweaking human embryos that we know so little about things that while we may be thinking we've tweaked an embryo in a safe way, and a human is born of it, the really bad dysgenic properties may not be manifest until later in life. Egg-freezing stirs the same feelings in me. On a related note, one of my aunts is an ob/gyn doctor, and I've heard her say many times that for a very wide variety of reasons it is best that children be had earlier rather than later (20s instead of 30s, 30s instead of 40s, etc.) for both men and women (but especially women). I don't know what I'm getting at, I guess all I can say is, damn, we have it tough, I wish I knew of good answers.