4 ms·

It seems like the obvious answer is that no-one is enveloping galaxies in Dyson spheres. As Dyson says at the end of the article: "The failure of one guess does

It seems like the obvious answer is that no-one is enveloping galaxies in Dyson spheres. As Dyson says at the end of the article: "The failure of one guess does not mean that we should stop looking for aliens." The Dyson sphere is really just the extrapolation of 1950s USA - maximize comsumption, ignore pollution, expand at all costs.

greggman 12y ago
There are other extrapolations. Humans put their minds in computers -> people need more and more computing power to do the things they want to do -> all available matter is turned into processors -> energy is need to run them all. They only thing limited humans at that point is matter for processors and energy to run them. Everything else is pointless. That has nothing to do with "maximize comsumption, ignore pollution, expand at all costs."
- toomuchtodo 12y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accelerando#Plot_concepts http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accelerando#Plot_concepts
- Tloewald 12y ago
  This is exactly "maximize consumption, ignore pollution, expand at all costs". When you decide that your use of energy / matter transcends all other purposes (including the evolution of other life) then exactly what are your priorities?
nickbauman 12y ago
> maximize comsumption, ignore pollution, expand at all costs Exactly this. I don't think a supercivilization would emerge as one with this maxim. It would die in its own cradle. Likewise, I believe our problems of this nature must be solved here, at home, before moving out and spreading our tragic narrative elsewhere.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- nik61 12y ago
  This comment is being downvoted for no good reason? It is a pessimistic but valid slant on this discussion I'd say.
  - nickbauman 12y ago
    Hey, thanks. I think I may have knocked an inviolable shibboleth within the HN community, so it's natural that it would be down-voted.
atlantic 12y ago
Precisely. The only thing this study tells us is that no galactic-scale civilization in the 100 or so closest galaxies fits the pattern imagined by the America of the 1950s. I find that strangely reassuring.
kiba 12y ago
How are we served letting the sun radiate energy without being used?
imglorp 12y ago
Exactly. What if the smart cultures have realized the best way is to live quietly, sustainably in balance with nature on their planets. This might well mean not expending the vast energy needed to go to space. Perhaps also they are comfortable with themselves and do not need to seek out everyone else.

greggman 12y ago

There are other extrapolations. Humans put their minds in computers -> people need more and more computing power to do the things they want to do -> all available matter is turned into processors -> energy is need to run them all. They only thing limited humans at that point is matter for processors and energy to run them. Everything else is pointless. That has nothing to do with "maximize comsumption, ignore pollution, expand at all costs."

toomuchtodo 12y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accelerando#Plot_concepts http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accelerando#Plot_concepts
Tloewald 12y ago
This is exactly "maximize consumption, ignore pollution, expand at all costs". When you decide that your use of energy / matter transcends all other purposes (including the evolution of other life) then exactly what are your priorities?

nickbauman 12y ago

> maximize comsumption, ignore pollution, expand at all costs Exactly this. I don't think a supercivilization would emerge as one with this maxim. It would die in its own cradle. Likewise, I believe our problems of this nature must be solved here, at home, before moving out and spreading our tragic narrative elsewhere.

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
nik61 12y ago
This comment is being downvoted for no good reason? It is a pessimistic but valid slant on this discussion I'd say.
- nickbauman 12y ago
  Hey, thanks. I think I may have knocked an inviolable shibboleth within the HN community, so it's natural that it would be down-voted.

atlantic 12y ago

Precisely. The only thing this study tells us is that no galactic-scale civilization in the 100 or so closest galaxies fits the pattern imagined by the America of the 1950s. I find that strangely reassuring.

kiba 12y ago

How are we served letting the sun radiate energy without being used?

imglorp 12y ago

Exactly. What if the smart cultures have realized the best way is to live quietly, sustainably in balance with nature on their planets. This might well mean not expending the vast energy needed to go to space. Perhaps also they are comfortable with themselves and do not need to seek out everyone else.