5 ms·

> Would it have made any sense at all if anyone made the same claim about, say, Windows game development? In Windows game development you've have a long histor

by rodgerd 12y ago

> Would it have made any sense at all if anyone made the same claim about, say, Windows game development? In Windows game development you've have a long history of many ways to distribute your wares, with different pros and cons. Not so much for Androids or iOS. Note that similar complaints have been levelled at Steam, which is the closest thing to the iOS model.

eridius 12y ago
Is there really that much of a difference between "Click [here](link-to-app-store) to buy this game!" and "Click [here](link-to-self-hosted-page) to buy this game!"? The only real difference I can think of is when software was primarily distributed via physical media, but that hasn't been the primary distribution mechanism for a while (and I would expect that nearly all software these days doesn't even have an option for physical media).
- jblow 12y ago
  There are massive differences. For example, in the Windows world you are allowed to find out who likes your stuff and build relationships with them.
  - s73v3r 12y ago
    You mean iOS developers aren't allowed to do things like have Twitter accounts, Facebook pages, or host forums?
  - eridius 12y ago
    Relationships? What are you talking about? I can't recall the last time I ever felt I had a "relationship" with a game developer, on _any_ platform. The only way I can meaningfully interpret your claim is by replacing "build relationships with them" to "and market directly to them", i.e. being able to email your customers with marketing messages. And I'm glad Apple doesn't give my email address to everyone I buy an app from. The only other interpretation I can think of is "Apple doesn't let you respond to reviews on the app store", but the ability to respond to reviews is not an industry-wide expectation. I can't think of anywhere before the rise of mobile gaming that anyone considered the idea that a game developer should be able to respond to reviews.
    - jblow 12y ago
      It's not about giving your email address to everyone (I wouldn't want that either), but it's about having the friction-free option of doing so. There are a number of game-makers for whom I absolutely want to be emailed when they make something new, because I love their stuff. That doesn't happen on iOS very easily.
      - eridius 12y ago
        Why not? Every app page has a link to the developer's site, and the developer's site can offer a way to subscribe to some sort of newsletter. And games often provide links in the game itself to view information about the game developer. Edit: I recognize that it's not particularly common for developers to try and encourage users to sign up for some sort of marketing. But I think that's just because developers haven't really considered it to be an acceptable thing to ask users of their games for, rather than any actual difficulty in doing so.
    - roblev 12y ago
      I would think jblow knows what he's talking about here, he's delivered at least one great game to the world (to me, Braid had the perfect difficulty ramp and an awesome level of inventiveness). As a buyer on Steam actually I didn't feel I had a direct relationship with jblow as the developer, but I would have been very happy to receive his marketing material, especially if it was programming tips! http://www.quora.com/What-are-the-5-tips-of-a-productive-developer http://www.quora.com/What-are-the-5-tips-of-a-productive-dev... (...looking forward to The Witness)
    - djur 12y ago
      > I can't recall the last time I ever felt I had a "relationship" with a game developer, on _any_ platform. The original post here was on Spiderweb Software's forums, which have been around in some incarnation or another for over a decade and hosts a community that has built up around their games. This is a company that has always relied on a close relationship with its customers.
    - rodgerd 12y ago
      > Relationships? What are you talking about? I can't recall the last time I ever felt I had a "relationship" with a game developer, on _any_ platform. iD/John Carmack, David Braben, Sid Meier, Rockstar, Volition, Gearbox Software... I could keep rattling off names and developers, but those are all examples of companies and individuals who have dedicated followings who follow them from game to game or platform to platform.
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  > The only real difference I can think of is when software was primarily distributed via physical media, but that hasn't been the primary distribution mechanism for a while It was a major distribution medium until fairly recently, even if not primary. Heck, you can still go into lots of retailers and buy physical media for PC games.
  - eridius 12y ago
    For some games, yes. But not for most of them.
s73v3r 12y ago
So? That's not really relevant. You still have insane amounts of competition on Windows, much like you do on iOS. On either platform, marketing is a requirement.

by rodgerd 12y ago

eridius 12y ago

Is there really that much of a difference between "Click [here](link-to-app-store) to buy this game!" and "Click [here](link-to-self-hosted-page) to buy this game!"? The only real difference I can think of is when software was primarily distributed via physical media, but that hasn't been the primary distribution mechanism for a while (and I would expect that nearly all software these days doesn't even have an option for physical media).

jblow 12y ago
There are massive differences. For example, in the Windows world you are allowed to find out who likes your stuff and build relationships with them.
- s73v3r 12y ago
  You mean iOS developers aren't allowed to do things like have Twitter accounts, Facebook pages, or host forums?
- eridius 12y ago
  Relationships? What are you talking about? I can't recall the last time I ever felt I had a "relationship" with a game developer, on _any_ platform. The only way I can meaningfully interpret your claim is by replacing "build relationships with them" to "and market directly to them", i.e. being able to email your customers with marketing messages. And I'm glad Apple doesn't give my email address to everyone I buy an app from. The only other interpretation I can think of is "Apple doesn't let you respond to reviews on the app store", but the ability to respond to reviews is not an industry-wide expectation. I can't think of anywhere before the rise of mobile gaming that anyone considered the idea that a game developer should be able to respond to reviews.
  - jblow 12y ago
    It's not about giving your email address to everyone (I wouldn't want that either), but it's about having the friction-free option of doing so. There are a number of game-makers for whom I absolutely want to be emailed when they make something new, because I love their stuff. That doesn't happen on iOS very easily.
    - eridius 12y ago
      Why not? Every app page has a link to the developer's site, and the developer's site can offer a way to subscribe to some sort of newsletter. And games often provide links in the game itself to view information about the game developer. Edit: I recognize that it's not particularly common for developers to try and encourage users to sign up for some sort of marketing. But I think that's just because developers haven't really considered it to be an acceptable thing to ask users of their games for, rather than any actual difficulty in doing so.
  - roblev 12y ago
    I would think jblow knows what he's talking about here, he's delivered at least one great game to the world (to me, Braid had the perfect difficulty ramp and an awesome level of inventiveness). As a buyer on Steam actually I didn't feel I had a direct relationship with jblow as the developer, but I would have been very happy to receive his marketing material, especially if it was programming tips! http://www.quora.com/What-are-the-5-tips-of-a-productive-developer http://www.quora.com/What-are-the-5-tips-of-a-productive-dev... (...looking forward to The Witness)
  - djur 12y ago
    > I can't recall the last time I ever felt I had a "relationship" with a game developer, on _any_ platform. The original post here was on Spiderweb Software's forums, which have been around in some incarnation or another for over a decade and hosts a community that has built up around their games. This is a company that has always relied on a close relationship with its customers.
  - rodgerd 12y ago
    > Relationships? What are you talking about? I can't recall the last time I ever felt I had a "relationship" with a game developer, on _any_ platform. iD/John Carmack, David Braben, Sid Meier, Rockstar, Volition, Gearbox Software... I could keep rattling off names and developers, but those are all examples of companies and individuals who have dedicated followings who follow them from game to game or platform to platform.
dragonwriter 12y ago
> The only real difference I can think of is when software was primarily distributed via physical media, but that hasn't been the primary distribution mechanism for a while It was a major distribution medium until fairly recently, even if not primary. Heck, you can still go into lots of retailers and buy physical media for PC games.
- eridius 12y ago
  For some games, yes. But not for most of them.

s73v3r 12y ago

So? That's not really relevant. You still have insane amounts of competition on Windows, much like you do on iOS. On either platform, marketing is a requirement.